Chris Wright Confirmation Hearing

Senator Heinrich (00:00):

… during the Cold War through the Office of Environmental Management. And although only a fraction of its budget goes to Energy Research, DOE is still the single largest supporter of basic research in the physical sciences, not just through the Office of Science, but also through the Title XVII Clean Energy Financing Program and the Advanced Research Projects Agency. The Secretary of Energy must recognize the importance of DOE's research and development programs at the national labs and not just for energy production, but also for efficient energy use, national security, cyber security, climate change, and maintaining our position of leadership in the world.

(00:44)
The Secretary of Energy must also adapt to a rapidly evolving energy landscape driven by three empirical trends. First, electricity demand is growing for the first time in decades. Advances in generative artificial intelligence technologies and investments in manufacturing and data centers are driving up electricity demand. In fact, nationwide electric demand is expected to grow by 15% in just the next five years.

(01:14)
Second, distributed renewable energy is getting cheaper. The deployment of renewable energy continues to accelerate exponentially not in a linear fashion and consistently outpaces EIA predictions year over year. The pace of this deployment is driving down energy costs, giving Americans more energy freedom to choose how they want to heat and cool their homes or fuel their cars and trucks.

(01:40)
Third, clean energy is driving economic growth. According to the International Energy Agency, clean energy accounted for 10% of global GDP growth In 2023.

(01:53)
If confirmed, Mr. Wright, you'll inherit a department that has received historic levels of investment to fund programs and policies that are literally transforming the US economy. These programs and policies were authorized by landmark legislation including the Energy Act of 2020, the CHIPS and Science Act, the Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act, and the Inflation Reduction Act and those investments are paying off.

(02:21)
Two years after CHIPS and Science, companies have announced more than 395 billion of investments in semiconductors and electronics and the creation of over 115,000 jobs primarily in manufacturing.

(02:37)
Two years after passage of the Inflation Reduction Act, businesses including battery manufacturers and auto companies, have announced 493 billion of investments. A 71% increase from the two-year period preceding that legislation.

(02:54)
And three years after the passage of the bipartisan infrastructure law, the administration announced $568 billion in projects for over 66,000 projects across our country.

(03:08)
These landmark laws give the Secretary of Energy new resources and authorities to implement programs and policies that will unlock hundreds of gigawatts worth of solar, wind, and grid battery projects that have been stuck in interconnection queues all around the country. This hearing will provide you with the opportunity to demonstrate to the committee that you'll implement Congress's vision of energy abundance and enforce and uphold the laws of the land. I look forward to this discussion.

Senator Lee (03:43):

Thank you, Senator Heinrich. And to be clear, we did follow the rules of the committee and it did not arrive after business hours. They arrived at 5:40 PM. The bipartisan front office of the committee is in fact open until 6:00 PM. and so those came during business hours.

(03:58)
We're now going to hear from Senator Hickenlooper who will be introducing Secretary Wright, or Mr. Wright, soon to be Secretary Wright.

Senator Hickenlooper (04:07):

Thank you. Mr. Chair, Ranking Member Heinrich. I'm here today to introduce Chris Wright before the Energy and Natural Resources Committee, a fellow Coloradan on his birthday, and someone I've known for a number of years. I first met Chris at a fundraising effort for scholarships for needy kids. We share the fact that we both married way over our heads. His wife Liz is behind him and like my wife Robin is far outshines him in many regards.

(04:41)
Chris won't be surprised to hear me say that we disagree on a lot of things and we are almost legendary, probably 12 or 13 years ago at a fancy Easter dinner in the middle of the day in getting rather heated over some of the issues around energy. And I think what was interesting, my wife was very worried about our hosts and us being invited back, whereas I don't think Chris and I took any offense at all. And I think that some people would be surprised that I'm introducing him here. And yet he's a scientist who has invested his life around energy and he's indeed an unrestrained enthusiast for fossil fuels in almost every regard. But he studied nuclear.

(05:31)
He started out at University of Colorado just so we're perfectly clear, but somehow he ended up at MIT. One of my associates is known to have haunted. And he studied nuclear there in detail, got a masters. His first years working were in solar. He has experience in wind. He is a practitioner and a key innovator around geothermal and the incredible potential that we have in geothermal.

(06:04)
He is a scientist who is open to discussion and he is again a scientist who is a successful entrepreneur and has that ability to assess what is possible and what isn't.

(06:21)
Again, I am well known for the last 40 years, I've been worried and working to address climate change and I worry about the acceleration of the feedback loops. It could make what we saw in Los Angeles over the past couple of weeks a grim foreshadowing of other events that could come. But I think that what we're looking at now is the need for a comprehensive approach to energy at every regard. Chris has spent a lot of time looking at poverty, not just in this country but around the world and how energy affects that and how it affects the health of people from, in different countries. He is fully versed on the assessments we've made both on this committee and as a congress in the past couple of years to make investments around energy and he respects that.

(07:24)
And I think as we go forward, I look forward to continuing the robust discussions, and I'm not going to hold back, and I know that he won't hold back either. And I think that's part of the key of a democracy is to be able to sit down and really thrash out your beliefs and what the facts are and be able to measure them. I think we both learned and evolved over the years on a number of issues and I have high optimism we can work together. And I look forward to figuring out what are the best ways and the fastest ways we can address the climate challenges we face.

(08:02)
So Chris, thank you for being willing to do this public service and I look forward to the discussion.

Senator Lee (08:09):

We'll hear next from Senator Hoeven.

Senator Hoeven (08:11):

Thank you, Chairman Lee, and also Ranking Member Heinrich.

(08:17)
Welcome. Welcome to you Chris and to your family. It's great to meet all of you. I think it's fantastic that you're here and of course, Liz, very important that you're here. That was obvious right away when he came and gave you that huge hug. Moral support is unbelievable. And then to have your mom here is pretty cool, on your birthday, 60th birthday. And as far as your grandson Miles, seven months, but it's never too soon to start getting used to senate hearings. So I think bringing him and getting him used to what goes on is great.

(08:49)
I'm really pleased to follow up Senator Hickenlooper. I have great respect for him. Your home state senator, he's a trained geologist, he knows energy and he's worked and helped me on a lot of things and I'm very pleased to join you in this introduction. And really it's appropriate because you live in Colorado, but an awful lot of your work's been done in North Dakota, in my state of North Dakota, and you've had a huge, huge impact.

(09:13)
When I started as governor in North Dakota in 2001, we produced 100,000, less than 100,000 barrels of oil, and it was going down. It was going down because we were drilling 14,000-foot vertical wells that were more cost-effective places to do it. So I started a policy called Empower North Dakota and it wasn't just about producing more oil and gas, it was about producing energy as Senator Hickenlooper said, from all sources.

(09:42)
And we do in North Dakota now. We are a powerhouse in energy, and you know it well. But it came from creating the right climate, the right legal tax and regulatory climate to encourage energy development. And it came down to getting entrepreneurs, great thinkers, people who were smart, well-trained and motivated people who'd gone to places like MIT and Berkeley and had the latest, greatest understanding of technologies and all kinds of things. People who would create companies, let's see like Pinnacle Technologies that started the hydraulic fracturing mapping industry so folks could figure out where the energy was. And then folks that chaired companies like Stroud Energy and then started their own companies like Liberty Energy to actually do it, to unlock this energy potential here and do it with the best environmental stewardship, the smallest footprint.

(10:38)
And as a result of folks like that, North Dakota went from less than a hundred thousand barrels of oil going down to 1.5 million barrels a day. 1.5 million barrels of oil a day. Not to mention all the natural gas with the best environmental stewardship in the world. And the reality is you're that entrepreneur and I'm talking about right now, you and others. And that's what we're talking about. So if we really want all the above, we need guys like you, Chris, that really understand energy, all aspects of energy, whether it's as one of my favorite presidents used to say nuclear energy or oil and gas or anything else, you have that incredible knowledge and understanding and capability to drive this technology to truly make us energy dominant. And that's what we need to focus on. Regardless of what kind of energy you may or may not favor to truly have an all the above, we need to continue to drive that technology curve and I can't think of anyone better able to do that based on your training, your education, your interest, your accomplishments and your experience. And I'm just pleased that you're willing, you and your family are willing to stand up and serve.

(11:57)
Thank you so much for being here today. Appreciate it. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Senator Lee (12:03):

Thanks so much. Mr. Wright, we are now going to swear you in. If you will stand and I'll administer the oath.

(12:17)
Do you solemnly swear that the testimony you're about to give to the Senate Committee on Energy and Natural Resources will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?

Chris Wright (12:26):

I do.

Senator Lee (12:27):

Thank you.

(12:29)
Now I will now ask you three questions before you turn to your opening statement. Three questions that we ask to each nominee before this committee. Will you be available to appear before the committee and other congressional committees to represent the department positions and respond to issues of concern to Congress?

Chris Wright (12:50):

I will.

Senator Lee (12:51):

Are you aware of any personal holdings, investments or interests that could constitute a conflict of interest or create the appearance of such a conflict should you be confirmed and assume the office to which you've been nominated by the president?

Chris Wright (13:05):

I am not.

Senator Lee (13:06):

Are you involved or do you have any assets held in a blind trust?

Chris Wright (13:11):

I do not.

Senator Lee (13:12):

Thank you.

(13:15)
Now you may proceed with your opening statement. Thank you.

Chris Wright (13:20):

Thank you Mr. Chairman, Ranking Member Heinrich and members of the committee. Thank you also to Senator Hickenlooper and Senator Hoeven for your kind remarks, friendship and for your continued service to our Centennial State and great nation.

(13:35)
Before I begin my remarks, I would like to recognize the members of my family who have joined me today. My wife Liz, my daughter Skylar and her husband Greg, my seven-month-old grandson's, Miles, my son Arthur, his fiancee Alowell. Also in the crowd not needing identification is my mother Gayla, sister Kim, many other extended family and friends as well. The most fortunate event in my very fortunate life was meeting my wife Liz when I was 18 years old. I came home that night and told my sister that I had met the woman that I would marry.

(14:20)
It is truly an honor to appear before this committee as President-elect Trump's nominee for Secretary of Energy. I am humbled by the great responsibility this position holds. America has an historic opportunity to secure our energy systems, deliver leadership in scientific and technological innovation, steward our weapons stockpiles and meet Cold War legacy waste commitments.

(14:49)
I call myself a science geek turned tech nerd turned lifelong energy entrepreneur. My fascination with energy started at a young age in Denver, Colorado. I enrolled at MIT specifically to work on fusion energy. I started graduate school at UC-Berkeley where I worked on solar energy as well as power electronics.

(15:12)
Energy is the essential agent of change that enables everything that we do. Everything. A low-energy society is poor. A highly energized society can bring health, wealth, and opportunity for all. The stated mission of the company that I founded, Liberty Energy, is to better human lives through energy. Liberty works directly in oil, natural gas, next-generation geothermal and has partnerships in next-generation nuclear energy and new battery technology.

(15:48)
Energy has been a lifelong passion of mine and I-

Protester 1 (15:51):

[inaudible 00:15:51] profit while LA burns! [inaudible 00:15:53] profit while LA burns! Fossil fuel CEOs are destroying communities like mine! Fossil fuel CEOs are profiting while destroying communities like mine!

Chris Wright (16:03):

Energy has been a lifelong passion of mine, and I've never been shy about that fact. Then again, I've never been shy about much. President Trump shares my passion for energy and, if confirmed, I will work tirelessly to implement his bold agenda as an unabashed steward for all sources of affordable, reliable, and secure American energy.

(16:27)
I see three immediate tasks where I'll focus my attention if I get the privilege of being confirmed. The first is to unleash American energy at home and abroad to restore our energy dominance. The security of our nation begins with energy. Previous administrations have viewed energy as a liability instead of the immense national asset that it is. To compete globally, we must expand energy production including commercial nuclear and liquefied natural gas and cut the cost of energy for Americans.

(17:03)
Second, we must lead the world in innovation and technology breakthroughs. Throughout my lifetime, technology and innovation have immeasurably enhanced the human condition. We must protect and accelerate the work of the department's national laboratory network to assure and secure America's competitive advantage and its security. I commit to working with Congress on the important missions of the national laboratories.

(17:32)
Third, we must build things in America again and remove barriers to progress. Federal policies today make it too easy to stop projects and very hard to start and complete projects. This makes energy more expensive and less reliable. President Trump is committed to lowering energy costs and to do so we must prioritize cutting red tape, enabling the private sector investments and building the infrastructure we need to make energy more affordable for families and businesses.

(18:05)
I've met with almost every member of the committee and I appreciate the perspective, priorities, and insight that you have shared. As a nerdy guy who reads and studies data, I will need the guidance and partnership of this committee. I feel confident we can work together to make a difference. I look forward to answering your questions and, if confirmed, shepherding the president's bold energy agenda to unleash energy security and prosperity.

(18:33)
Mr. Chairman, thank you for the opportunity to be here today. I look forward to answering the committee's questions.

Senator Lee (18:39):

Thank you very much, Mr. Wright.

(18:40)
We'll now proceed to five-minute rounds with Democrats and Republicans alternating in order of seniority and order of arrival and we'll begin those right now.

(18:51)
Mr. Wright, Liberty Energy's Bettering Human Lives report is something I find an informative document. I've got a copy of it right here. It's something that brings what I regard as a pretty clear-headed perspective to the climate change dialogue, which I think has been sorely missing in our discussion of many of these issues.

(19:13)
As with anything that we do and basically everything that we build, there are trade-offs in energy. There are trade-offs at the nexus of energy security, energy poverty, economic prosperity, upward mobility and various environmental considerations. The US Department of Energy can play a role, but unfortunately during the Biden administration we've seen many levers within our system of government including and especially Department of Energy being used as part of a, quote, unquote, "Whole-of-government approach to reduce greenhouse gas emissions," and doing this without considering the consequences of this kind of unbalanced approach. The trade-offs that I mentioned aren't really taken into a consideration. It's one objective taken into account as part of a whole-of-government approach that has really harmed a lot of American families.

(20:16)
So how in your view can and should the Department of Energy focus on energy abundance and how will doing that help to restore the balance that American energy policy has been lacking over the last four years?

Chris Wright (20:31):

Thank you for the question, Senator, and for the points you made. Yes, energy is hard, but it is critical for our civilization and for the prosperity and security of our country. The Department of Energy, I'll start with just the magnificent 17 national labs that this launched during World War II and we're a key part of actually America winning that war and securing a post-war peace. Our labs have been pioneers in energy innovation across the spectrum. Very important for me is to keep the labs focused and energized to work on science, basic fundamental science, but also science that will someday and maybe someday soon have applications to energy. Our labs have a proud track record there and I want to champion that. And the labs and the energy department as a whole works across the energy spectrum with reasonable involvement in virtually every meaningful energy source we have today. So my mission would be to inspire people in the department and in the labs and across the network to focus on what's most important for Americans, which is growing the supply of affordable, reliable, secure American energy.

Senator Lee (21:49):

Growing the supply. That is a novel and very important concept to grasp, but especially at a moment when American energy demand is growing, growing because of our growing population, also growing because of the ways in which we use energy. With data centers and artificial intelligence, making a dent and about to make a much bigger dent in what it is that we need to energize our economy, it's a very poor time indeed to be declining in terms of our energy production relative to anticipated demand. It sounds like you grasped that fully and are ready to take that challenge on.

Chris Wright (22:30):

Yes, sir. I agree with you, Senator, very much.

Senator Lee (22:34):

An interim report that was released last month, the Department of Energy's Inspector General raised several pretty serious concerns regarding potential conflicts of interest within the Department of Energy's loan programs office. Those concerns include the troubling dual roles of some contractors who may be advising both the loan programs office and potential loan recipients at the same time. The IG recommended that the issuance of new loans might be suspended, should perhaps be suspended until these potential conflicts are fully addressed and the safeguards necessary to correct them are implemented.

(23:14)
If you're confirmed, will you commit to following the inspector general's recommendation and suspend the issuance of new loans until the loan program's office compliance with conflicts of interest regulations and contractual obligations is guaranteed?

Chris Wright (23:33):

If I have the privilege to be confirmed, I will immediately engage in that issue. Nothing is more important than the integrity of the loan process of following the rule of law. Without integrity, without fair processes, you lose confidence, you undermine business's ability to invest and where capital's deployed to. I'm aware of the report and we'll dive into that issue immediately.

Senator Lee (23:56):

Great. My five minutes are expired. We'll hear now from Senator Heinrich.

Senator Heinrich (24:01):

Thank you Chairman. Mr. Wright, I'm going to start with a real easy one. Will you commit to visiting both Sandia and Los Alamos National Labs in your first year if you're confirmed to secretary?

Chris Wright (24:13):

Thank you, Senator. I will absolutely commit to visit those two prestigious and hallowed institutions and I would love to coordinate with your staff and if at all possible we could visit together.

Senator Heinrich (24:25):

Great.

Chris Wright (24:25):

But I'm a huge fan of those two institutions and look forward to walking their halls.

Senator Heinrich (24:31):

I appreciate that very much.

(24:34)
I would like you to talk a little bit about your divestment plans. You do, and you've mentioned it, a lot of work in the energy space and we had a conversation about the need to maintain not only the avoidance of conflicts of interest, but also the avoidance of appearances of conflicts of interest. So can you talk a little bit about your plans for divestment?

Chris Wright (25:02):

Agree with all of that, Senator. I've been a lifelong entrepreneur in the energy space and of course I have submitted my disclosures of all of my work and the appropriate ethics counselors within the federal government have-

Protestor 2 (25:16):

Chris Wright, can your fracking liquid put out the fires in LA? People are dying and Big Oil billionaires like you don't care [inaudible 00:25:24].

Chris Wright (25:28):

Yeah, the appropriate ethics. People have reviewed my investments, my personal holdings and other interests, and I've agreed to take all the appropriate action to avoid any real conflicts or perceived conflicts of interest. I'm fully aligned with you there, Senator.

Senator Heinrich (25:43):

I appreciated your comments about the fidelity to the rule of law, and so I want to ask you a particular question in part because the OMB nominee has stated his support for using executive impoundment of funds passed by Congress in order to achieve spending reductions. And so I've got a little bit of a two-part question for you.

(26:09)
As secretary. If the OMB director was to try to direct your department not to fund a program or an activity that Congress had expressly appropriated funding for, would you follow the law?

Chris Wright (26:26):

Thank you, Senator. Yeah, my mission, the only way I roll, would be to follow the laws and statutes of the United States of America.

Senator Heinrich (26:38):

With respect to permitting, this last Congress, this committee actually, advanced a comprehensive, all-of-the-above permitting bill by a vote of 15 to 4. That law was not signed in the law because we have not reconciled it with the House. But I want to ask you because included in that package we're really important transmission reforms that would actually help us to meet the growing demand that we're seeing due to what's going on in artificial intelligence right now, the increased electrification of our economy, and an incredible bump in manufacturing that we've seen in the last couple of years.

(27:18)
So in your view, how important is it that transmission line permitting reform be included as part of any broader permitting reform that we may be able to achieve?

Chris Wright (27:31):

Thanks for that question, Senator. And thanks for also the wonderful dialogue we had in your office. I appreciated that very much. And I note we have lots of overlaps, lots of common interests, lots of common concerns.

(27:44)
And we've had roughly a hundred-year history in the United States of making electricity more affordable on inflation-adjusted terms and our grid more reliable, one of the engineering marvels of modern times. And as we discussed, we've seen that trend reverse and in the last few years we've seen electricity prices go up and the reliability of the grid go down. And both of us are very concerned about that, particularly as we're seeing future demand growth. And I agree with you entirely that being able to build new transmission lines to be able to re-power existing transmission lines and grow their capacity and many other things are very important to meet this growing demand of energy and hopefully return to a trend of a decline in the real cost of electricity and a growth in the reliability. I'm aligned with you there.

Senator Heinrich (28:39):

I am actually wearing my dad's IBEW 60 year pin today because it reminds me of the importance of that grid. DOE's grid deployment office has supported a lot of really valuable projects through the transmission facilitation program, including the South Line Transmission Project in my home state. These projects will save customers money and they increase grid reliability.

(29:08)
Can you assure me at a time when things like Project 2025 have proposed just eliminating the grid deployment office, that DOE will continue to use its authorities and its resources to support the kind of transmission projects that increase reliability and save customers money?

Chris Wright (29:31):

Senator, thank you for your dad's service in building our grid and maintaining it with its gorgeous track record all those years. And yes, I am aligned with you and will seek to find the best ways to improve our transmission grid, including expansion and new lines.

Senator Heinrich (29:51):

Thank you, Mr. Wright.

Senator Lee (29:53):

Senator Justice.

Senator Justice (29:57):

Well, thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you Mr. Wright, Chris, and thank you to all of his family. I mean, you being here is testimony to who you are, and that's really good stuff. Now I wish you happy birthday and I'd like to tell everyone just a little bit about me.

(30:18)
I am a new kid on the block. That's for dagum sure. I'm not a politician. I'm a business guy. And I'm hung up on this. I'm hung up on honor and truth and respect and reason and logic, and you'll find that as we go forward with me.

(30:38)
Now today, I tell you just this, I come from West Virginia and West Virginia truly knows energy. That's all there is to it. And I would just tell you this and I would promise you that this will be the case, energy is everything. Everything. If we think less than that, we are thinking absolutely wrong. At the end of the day, every country of the world, the more energy they have, the healthier they are, the longer they live. Energy is every single everything. It's the key to inflation. It's the key to our defense. It's the dollars that fund the Russian war with Ukraine. It is every single thing. And absolutely we have to solve this. We have to have a real energy strategy and we've got to solve this. I've had many, many conversations with President Trump. He absolutely believes exactly just this.

(31:46)
Chris, in these days ahead, you will have a task beyond belief, in my opinion. With all that being said, I know you'll carry on that task in a great, great way.

Senator Justice (32:01):

Now listen, from West Virginia you may think that all we can think about is one thing and one thing alone. I would tell you just this, we need to embrace all the energy forms. But with that being said, the moment in time when you absolutely believe that we can do without fossil fuels in this world today, you're living in a cave. You're absolutely living in a cave in my opinion. We don't need to blow our legs off so China or India can dominate in so many different ways. Absolutely today we need to solve the whole.

Speaker 1 (32:47):

It wasn't a cave. My friend Lionel lived in a home that's been burned down. Are you all going to ask any questions or are you going to softball on the climate this entire time? You all burned down-

Senator Justice (32:53):

I would just tell you just this. I think that gentleman is misdirected in his thought. But with all that being said, I would always be respectful to that gentleman, and that's how we all ought to be. So with all that being said, I would say just this to Chris. Chris, are you in a position of thinking, of embracing all the energy's forms, solving the whole riddle? And I'll ask that question just in that way, so please answer.

Chris Wright (33:29):

Senator, thank you for your question and your impassioned remarks. We share a passion for energy. And the reason I sit in front of you today is because President-elect Trump shares a passion for energy and an instinctual understanding that energy is not a sector of the economy, it's the sector of the economy that enables everything else we do. When I met him, he was just on fire about energy. He got how it impacts American quality of life, American economic strength, our geopolitical power, and what the possibilities are for the future, how we can make our children and grandchildren's lives so much better than ours. So I agree with you a hundred percent. Energy is core, it's central. We want energy from all sources we can, that can add to our pile of affordable, reliable, secure American energy.

Senator Justice (34:28):

Well, Chris, that pleases me, and I would just say just this. America has a big, big crisis right in front of them. If we don't solve this riddle in a year and a half from today, we will have a crisis like you can't imagine. With all that being said, we're sitting, we're sitting on the answer in America for America to be the footprint of the world. And we've got to do it. Mr. Chairman, I thank you so much for allowing me to speak. And Chris, I am positive you're going to be confirmed. And God bless each and every one of you for being here in the family. Thank you so much.

Chris Wright (35:07):

Thank you, Senator.

Senator Mike Lee (35:08):

Thanks, Senator Justice. Senator Cortez Masto.

Senator Cortez Masto (35:13):

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Let me right off say I do hope that the comedy of this committee continues into the next Congress, and I am disappointed that unfortunately right out of the gate we are creating controversy were none exist and shouldn't exist here. But I am hopeful that the comedy continues. Mr. Wright, congratulations on your nomination.

Chris Wright (35:35):

Thank you.

Senator Cortez Masto (35:36):

And thank you for your willingness to serve in this environment the way it is today. I appreciate that. Welcome to your family and to your wonderful mother being here as well. I appreciate that. Let me ask you a couple of questions that are important for Nevada. We've talked about this in our meeting and I thank you for meeting with me. But can Nevadans can on you to acknowledge that the failed Yucca Mountain Project is unworkable?

Chris Wright (35:58):

Senator, thank you for that question. And as we discussed, I think if you're going to build large infrastructure, and nuclear waste disposal would certainly fall in that category that has concerns, you need to have on board the local community as well. And I think Nevadans and as you've expressed clearly have deep concerns about seeing that facility go ahead, and I think that's your answer.

Senator Cortez Masto (36:24):

So President Trump has said he doesn't support waste at Yucca Mountain. So let me ask you again because you didn't really answer the question. Can Nevadans count on you to acknowledge that the failed Yucca Mountain Project is unworkable?

Chris Wright (36:37):

I'm new to politics as you can see and you'll see all day long today. I think that has been a clear record that Nevadans oppose the project. I will work with you and with senators across the country to find solutions for long-term disposal of nuclear waste. And I agree with you that a central part of that is going to be local buy-in on the project.

Senator Cortez Masto (37:04):

What is your understanding of DOE's role in defense and national security today?

Chris Wright (37:10):

It is essential. The NNSA as a part of DOE is the critical designer, maintainer, and builder through contractors of our nation's nuclear arsenal. This is the ultimate guarantor of our sovereignty. I take that responsibility very seriously. Together with the coming instabilities in our electrical grid, it is my single biggest concern in this job. We have lost our ability to enrich uranium in this country, to construct plutonium pits, and to do so many critical things that are key to our nuclear arsenal. I am highly motivated and highly concerned that we need to make progress on the safety and security of the stockpile of our nuclear weapons.

Senator Cortez Masto (37:58):

So the Department of Energy provides essential programs and research across all corners of my state. Its critical defense measures at the national security site that you talked about, our workforce cybersecurity collaboration that we have with our universities and colleges in Nevada, the public-private partnerships to create new innovative technologies is actually happening in Nevada thanks to legislation that we have passed, bipartisan legislation as well as the Inflation Reduction Act and the infrastructure Law. Let me ask you this. Would you push back on any attempts by the Trump administration to cut any of these critical programs?

Chris Wright (38:37):

Senator, I appreciate your passion for them. It's too early for me to give any specifics about this program or that program, but is cybersecurity critical for our country? Absolutely. Is that-

Senator Cortez Masto (38:50):

Let me be more specific, because you talked about that when I asked you about the role of DOE. You specifically talked about the national security site in Nevada. Would you push back on the Trump administration if they attempted to cut any critical funding to the programs for the national security site?

Chris Wright (39:05):

I will support to the extent I can all of our efforts in national security including those that are in Nevada.

Senator Cortez Masto (39:14):

Let me ask you this. You talked about in your comments to some of my colleagues that you want to grow the supply of energy. Define for me the sources of energy you're talking about that you would like to grow.

Chris Wright (39:25):

All sources of affordable, reliable-

Senator Cortez Masto (39:29):

What sources are they?

Chris Wright (39:30):

Pure energy.

Senator Cortez Masto (39:31):

Sure. Which sources?

Chris Wright (39:32):

It's different sources in different circumstances. Our economy today is underpinned by energy dominantly from oil and natural gas. Coal is a major source of energy in our country. Nuclear power is a major source of energy in our country. Hydropower is a major source of energy in our country. Wind and solar are growing rapidly. And geothermal, particularly in states like Nevada, is early on but has just significant running room to become a meaningful source of energy in the future. And every source of energy that either today or with technology innovation can be a growth engine for affordable, reliable, secure energy, I'm for all of those.

Senator Cortez Masto (40:14):

Good. You did not mention solar. Solar is the number one energy for us in Nevada. It's created jobs, it's growing our economy, and it has major impact. So I'm disappointed that I didn't hear solar coming out as a part of the energy, but I'm not going to assume anything. I'm just going to say the conversation we're going to have and continue to have around energy is important, and it should be balanced and is not just focused on fossil fuels. No matter what some of my colleagues say, there should be a balanced approach to it for our portfolio for energy, and that's what I'm looking for always.

Chris Wright (40:49):

I agree entirely, Senator. And if I didn't say solar, it was an oversight. I worked in solar energy. You have tremendous resources for that in Nevada, and we're seeing a lot of growth in solar energy and I expect that to continue.

Senator Cortez Masto (41:01):

Thank you.

Senator Mike Lee (41:02):

Senator Cassidy.

Senator Bill Cassidy (41:04):

Hey, Mr. Wright. I really enjoyed the conversation we had in my office. I like your emphasis upon abundance. I had a chance to scan your Bettering Human Lives from Liberty Energy, and I think you just nailed it. You're speaking about abundance both in terms of our natural resources, but the abundance it means in terms of an increasing per capita GDP. And we do it in a way that we lower emissions as we increase GDP. And you look at a country like Germany, and they have almost entered energy poverty, in which we have lowered our emissions on a per capita basis more than they and our economy has grown more than they. So I just want to, we're sympathetic on this, and I think frankly we should all be.

(41:45)
Now I'm also very interested, because one thing that I mentioned in our conversation, I've been very concerned about an offshoring of carbon emissions to countries like China. But as we offshore, we offshore the job. And that prosperity we're trying to build for working Americans, we lose to a working Chinese. Now they don't enforce their environmental regulations so their SOx and NOx and whatever blows over on us when we're trying to do it right, and they use it for a competitive advantage.

(42:16)
All that to lead into, and by the way you allude to that, you talk about how Great Britain has actually offshored their carbon intensity and then they reshore it through the products they buy. So it's an artificial depression in their carbon intensity. I think you bring a sophistication to this argument, this discussion, which is just like, we just need.

(42:38)
Now one thing I've been supporting is something called a foreign pollution fee, in which we look at the emissions profile of the US, you name it, concrete, and then you compare it to aluminum, let's say aluminum, aluminum. And we compare it to a competitor like China which does not enforce emissions, and we put a fee roughly equal to their avoided cost of not complying with internationally acceptable emission profile. Any thoughts on that? Because it seems very consistent with the problems you point out in the Bettering Human Lives from Liberty Energy.

Chris Wright (43:15):

Thank you for that question, Senator, and thank you for the great dialogue we had about all these issues: about energy, about bettering lives, about trade practices, about prosperity for Americans. I think yourself and I and President-elect Trump are very aligned on all of those. And I think you have a creative idea about how do we address some of these asymmetries that have developed. If you look at the data of economic growth in the United States versus manufacturing growth in the United States, in economic output, they roughly track for a century. And right after the year 2000, when China is admitted to the World Trade Organization, they diverged dramatically.

Senator Bill Cassidy (43:57):

With ours going down for the manufacturing and China's manufacturing going up, but also their emission profile exploding at the same time.

Chris Wright (44:04):

A hundred percent. And as you said, look, the United Kingdom and Germany and other of our European allies led with us and they've gone even further on I think this destructive habit of just moving their energy-intensive manufacturing out of their country and then "counting."

Senator Bill Cassidy (44:20):

So I'm taking that as a yes, you'll support my foreign pollution fee. But anyway, let me ask you, because one critical role of DOE is to help calculate the embedded emissions. Now some fear of that thinking it's going to be some regulatory crackdown. I see it as a way to competitively to out-compete others because if theirs is here and ours is there and we know that from this calculation, then that helps our domestic manufacturers because there'll be a higher fee placed upon the product coming from overseas. Did you follow how I'm saying that?

Chris Wright (44:54):

Yes. I'm following you, Senator.

Senator Bill Cassidy (44:56):

Now so DOE has a pilot project currently calculating embedded emissions. Would you commit to continuing to support that program?

Chris Wright (45:06):

Again, if I have the privilege to be confirmed, I will look into all of these efforts. It sounds like-

Speaker 1 (45:12):

Sir, I'm 18 years old, and I want a future. Your company-

Senator Mike Lee (45:16):

We will have order restored. There will be no additional outbursts. The officers will remove this individual from the room and we will continue with the hearing of the…

Speaker 1 (45:24):

Ask them. They're liars.

Senator Mike Lee (45:27):

I ask that the testimony be delayed until the room is cleared. Please proceed, Mr. Wright.

Senator Bill Cassidy (45:33):

May I suggest that the people who are protesting look at your monograph on building human lives, because it shows that US emissions have come down in absolute amounts, per capita amounts, every way you want to measure it since 2000, since 1990. We are doing the job led in part by the things that you and I have talked about in our meeting.

(45:54)
So going back to you also will be negotiating international energy partnerships through the Office of International Affairs. And you spoke about global leadership as well. It wasn't in your written remarks, but it was in your spoken testimony. You want to elaborate on that please?

Chris Wright (46:09):

Yes. As we discussed, energy is the enabler of everything we do. But America going from 20 years ago, the largest importer of oil in the world and the largest importer of natural gas in the world to today, the largest exporter of natural gas in the world, enormous growth in our geopolitical leverage. We were able to fill most of the gap when Russia invaded Ukraine and Russian gas imports into Europe were reduced. Most of the replacement gas came from the United States. We couldn't have done that 20 years ago.

Senator Bill Cassidy (46:41):

Thank you, Mr. Chair. And I'll just say we began the conference, the five minutes just talking about abundance for the American people. Now we talk about our abundance helping our allies. We're all about abundance. Thank you. Mr. Wright.

Chris Wright (46:52):

Thank you, Senator.

Senator Mike Lee (46:53):

Thank you, Senator Cassidy. Senator Hickenlooper.

Senator Hickenlooper (46:56):

Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you Mr. Wright for being here. As we consider our energy future, we have so many challenges to deal with: energy prices, energy poverty as you've written about, obviously climate change is such a big one. As Secretary, do you think there's the possibility that the Department of Energy could finally begin to build a plan, a comprehensive plan on how we deal with the energy future, but also really take a hard look at climate change?

Chris Wright (47:28):

Senator, yes, indeed. I'm very interested in that idea and it's certainly something I've been thinking about. The Department of Energy created a look into energy and what the future of energy might bring about 20 years ago. I think it's time to do that again and to look not just at energy and the energy trajectory we're on, but the other issues related to energy, and top among those, climate change.

Senator Hickenlooper (47:53):

And I think just on that note, and you have in the past some time ago, but describe how slowly climate change is evolving. It's so far out in the future, it probably shouldn't command as much attention. And yet, I continue and I think a lot of people are concerned about the acceleration and how soon can we recognize those feedback loops. We're talking about the salinity of the oceans, the massive ice melts, and calving of glaciers. Those things have the potential to create a much more rapid rate of change, and I think that's part of the ability to get a plan. And as of 2024, they're saying we're at about 1.5 degrees Celsius in increased temperature. If it goes much faster than that, do you think we should have some contingency plans ready so that we can address that scenario? Even now, we look at, again, the fires in Los Angeles, some of the hurricanes, these extreme weather events, and we're obviously not prepared for them. We don't have an insurance system that works. Each of those suggests or command that we should have backup systems in place.

Chris Wright (49:10):

Absolutely, Senator, as you know, I've studied and followed the data and the evolution of climate change for at least 20 years now. It is a global issue. It is a real issue. It's a challenging issue. And the solution to climate change is to evolve our energy system. I've worked on that most all of my career, again in nuclear and solar and geothermal and new battery storage technology now. And do I wish we could make faster progress? Absolutely. Are there things we can do, investments together through the Department of Energy to accelerate development of new energy technologies that are really the only pathway to address climate change? Absolutely. And we should have nothing but American leadership in this area. Energy and climate is a global problem, but America should be the leader, and I think President Trump is firmly aligned with that position as well.

Senator Hickenlooper (50:12):

Great. On a more parochial note, obviously the Renewable Energy Laboratory, a large portion of that work is done in Colorado. Do you feel that those budgets are properly spent, or do you think they should be reevaluated?

Chris Wright (50:30):

It's too early for me to comment on something like that. I visited the National Renewable Energy Laboratory years ago as a fellow energy guy in Denver. A lot of great work there, a lot of great humans there that are driving innovation and that are working with businesses too. It's not just basic research in the lab. It's very focused on applied research and new technologies. So I'm very keen to engage in a more detailed level with what's being on there and how to drive that further and faster.

Senator Hickenlooper (50:59):

This, I think, is going to be the first time I've ever gotten five questions in with testimony, so I'm not sure what that says. We spent a lot of work looking at the grid. And as we do begin to build infrastructure that can respond if we need to make more dramatic changes to our energy system, whether it's climate change or whatever other constraints may come along, we really have been stymied both in terms of the permitting process and finding ways that we can make sure that we protect local communities, make sure that their voice is heard, make sure that we respect the environmental importance of our landscapes, but at the same time realize we've got to move more rapidly in building things like electrical infrastructure. Can you talk a little bit towards electrical infrastructure?

Chris Wright (51:44):

Yes, Senator. I think you've hit… In the energy world, the most pressing problem we have is our electricity grid. And this problem is only going to get worse. I'm very concerned about that. We need to change the gear we've been in the last several years and we need to get serious about building infrastructure and investment, bringing the cost of electricity prices back down and keeping our grid stable. I'm deeply concerned about our current trajectory.

Senator Hickenlooper (52:11):

No, I appreciate that. Thank you. I yield back to the chair.

Senator Mike Lee (52:14):

Thank you, Senator Hickenlooper. Senator Hyde-Smith.

Senator Cindy Hyde-Smith (52:17):

Thank you, Mr. Chairman and thank you Mr. Wright and this lovely family that you have behind you. I certainly enjoyed our visit in my office when we had the opportunity to discuss the importance of this committee, the importance of what you will be doing, and your leadership. Everybody in here sitting up here, we have economic developers come to our state. And we certainly want economic development. We want good jobs for our citizens. And so much of that is a part of what kind of energy can we provide for that company. So thank you for discussing those things with me, because they're certainly important to my people in Mississippi as well as other states.

(53:01)
The Department of Energy themselves, they classify nuclear energy as the largest source of clean power in the United States. And containment, as we well know, is critical to every aspect of nuclear energy. High-efficiency particulate air filters, what we refer to as the HEPA filters, are the operational barrier between the containment and the release of radioactive particles. So I'm proud in my home state at Mississippi State University where my daughter's in graduate school there but not in this area, they have been for a long time researching new technologies in order to develop better performances and the capabilities of these HEPA filters for new reactors, containment, ventilation. And this research really plays an important role in advancing the next generation filtration systems that we're all concerned with, because we're certainly concerned about the future of the policies that we're passing now for Miles when he's an adult of how the things we're talking about today that will affect him. And what do you see as the deficiencies related to containment, ventilation issues for waste processing and new generations of power reactors?

Chris Wright (54:29):

So thank you, Senator, for the question. And thank you for our fabulous dialogue and for what you do for the great state of Mississippi. You kept hitting on technology, and technology at Mississippi State. Technology really is the key for growing our energy future, for both growing more abundance to better lives.

Speaker 2 (54:49):

The climate crisis is here. LA is burning. It's because of fossil fuel companies and big oil billionaires. People are-

Senator Mike Lee (54:55):

The committee will stand in recess until the Capitol police can restore order in the committee. Committee will be in order. Committee will be in order. Committee will be in order. The committee will stand in recess until the Capitol Police can restore order.

Speaker 3 (55:12):

Reject Chris Wright. LA burns.

Senator Mike Lee (55:13):

The committee will stand in recess-

Speaker 3 (55:14):

Reject Chris Wright. LA burns.

Senator Mike Lee (55:16):

Until the US capitol police can restore order.

Speaker 3 (55:20):

Reject Chris Wright. LA burns.

Senator Mike Lee (55:23):

Committee will stand in recess until the Capitol Police can restore order.

Senator Cindy Hyde-Smith (55:31):

Thank you. I think we've figured out it's every other speaker here, so just heads up. But I drew out a lot of them, so I'm sorry about that.

Chris Wright (55:43):

No, and you were talking about advancements in nuclear technology. It's already a significant source of energy in the United States, but it hasn't grown in decades. How do we get it growing again? How does that research in Mississippi on air filtration and on research so many other places, how do we get it going again?

(56:05)
My view on that is building large projects in this country, we're seeing that with transmission lines and so many other things, very hard to do. We need to fix that problem. A typical nuclear reactor is a gigawatt. It's a thousand megawatts. The last ones we built took well over a decade and multiples over cost budget. Fortunately with nuclear, we have a new generation of reactors that are smaller and they'll be more manufactured in a facility. Anything that's manufactured in a facility, think a semiconductor or a bike or something, the cost of those are coming down. Anything that's built on location, the cost of those have been going up.

(56:47)
So we've got to figure out how to get some of these cost barriers out of the way. We've got to get better technologies like they're working on at Mississippi State to get Americans comfortable with the safety of nuclear, with the security of nuclear. But I think the facts and the technologies today are pretty compelling. Nuclear today is a little less than 20% of US electricity. That's pretty significant. But we also have to remember, electricity is just one sliver of energy.

(57:17)
The biggest use of energy is high-temperature process heat. And I would say it's the most important use of energy, because it's how we make steel and cement and metals and all those things that we make everything else out of. We can't build an internet or a car or factory without those materials. Nuclear could provide energy, could provide high-temperature heat to really impact manufacturing as well. There's just so much room to run and to grow for nuclear energy. And I think we're going to see a broad investment across our country in the research and the enabling technologies. And hopefully, before long we're going to see the energy source deployed widely as well.

Senator Cindy Hyde-Smith (58:03):

It is so refreshing to hear you say those things, and I so look forward to working with you. And all the questions have been so good today, but it really gives us hope and optimism. Thank you for your willingness to serve, and I'm out of time.

Chris Wright (58:20):

Thank you, Senator.

Senator Mike Lee (58:24):

Senator Hirono, you're up next.

Senator Mazie Hirono (58:27):

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Before I get to my questions, I just want to note that we did not receive information relating to this nominee until really late yesterday. And it would've been good if we could have followed the process that would've given us more time, which meant that this hearing would not be happening today.

(58:48)
So for the nominee, as part of my responsibilities as a member of this, as well as all my other committees, I asked the following two initial questions to ascertain the fitness of the nominee for the job. So I ask you, since you became a legal adult, have you ever made unwanted requests for sexual favors or committed any verbal or physical harassment or assault of a sexual nature?

Chris Wright (59:12):

I have not.

Senator Mazie Hirono (59:13):

Have you ever faced discipline or entered into a settlement relating to this kind of conduct?

Chris Wright (59:18):

I have not.

Senator Mazie Hirono (59:21):

It is shocking to see the devastation that is caused by the wildfires in Los Angeles, and of course we're seeing that it's shocking. In 2023, a wildfire killed 102 people and destroyed the town of Lahaina on Maui. And Hawaiian Electric, which is our major utility company, received a $95 million award from the DOE to help in rebuilding Maui's electric grid and reduce the risk of future wildfires. The state of Hawaii has also received other support and funding from the DOE to proceed with this kind of modernization. Do you acknowledge the need for improvements to our electric grids that will reduce the risk of wildfires and ensure reliable access to power?

Chris Wright (01:00:16):

Senator, thank you for your question. And boy, I remember watching with horror the fires on Lahaina and the fires today in LA. It is absolute human tragedy. It is devastating. But to answer your question, absolutely, yes. We need to improve our electric grid, both for increased supply, for increased resilience to natural disasters and events.

Senator Mazie Hirono (01:00:38):

As we see these kinds of natural disasters, I think states are. Municipalities will need help from the DOE. So will you continue allocating funding for grid improvements as authorized by Congress? Yes or no?

Chris Wright (01:00:53):

Well, I'm not sure it's quite as simple as that, but I think that my short answer would be yes. Of course I want to work with you and other states who increase grid resilience.

Senator Mazie Hirono (01:01:00):

I appreciate that. The DOE is required to ensure that all construction and repair projects funded by the DOE under the Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act pay prevailing wages. Will you pay prevailing wages as required under the Infrastructure law that I just mentioned?

Chris Wright (01:01:21):

Senator, if I have the privilege to be confirmed, I will follow the laws and statutes of the United States.

Senator Mazie Hirono (01:01:27):

And that would mean paying prevailing wages on these kinds of projects. The Washington Post reported that in April, 2024, Donald Trump told a group of about 24 oil executives at Mar-a-Lago that they should raise $1 billion for his campaign, which will be a deal, given his commitment to reversing environmental regulations, expanding oil and gas leasing on federal land, and approval of natural gas exports. Did you attend that meeting in Mar-a-Lago?

Chris Wright (01:01:58):

I was at a dinner with President Trump in Mar-a-Lago in April. Quite a bit different than what you just described, but yes, I was at a dinner.

Senator Mazie Hirono (01:02:08):

Well, it was reported that he talked about a $1 billion. So do you think that it was appropriate for the President to even put forth the possibility of such a deal?

Chris Wright (01:02:20):

I was at the dinner and the President put forward no such deal.

Senator Mazie Hirono (01:02:25):

That's not what was reported. As Secretary of Energy, you will have oversight over a lot of contracts, grants, and loan guarantees. Are you prepared to engage in vigorous oversight of the DOE's funding, even if President Trump pressures you to approve sweetheart deals to one of his favorite businesses? Will you be objective should you be confirmed?

Chris Wright (01:02:53):

I have followed rigorous and ethical business practices my whole life, Senator, and will continue to do exactly that at the Department of Energy if I have the privilege of being confirmed.

Senator Mazie Hirono (01:03:06):

I only have a little bit of time, but I do want to get to this. If you are confirmed, your obligation will be to the American people, not to the shareholders or board members for an oil and gas company. Would you allow all exports of natural gas to China and anywhere else around the world regardless of whether the exports would increase heating and power bills for the American people?

Chris Wright (01:03:31):

Senator, I'd love to have more time to talk about natural gas exports. The brief history of them is as we've grown our natural gas exports, our price of natural gas has gone down because the industry, natural gas production industry, has benefited from scale.

Senator Mazie Hirono (01:03:44):

So you're telling me that you would. I'm asking whether you would take into consideration what the impact for the cost of energy in America would be if you allow export of these, oil and gas. So you would keep that

Sen. Hirono (01:04:00):

That uppermost in mind, right? With what the impact of these kinds of exports would be to the cost of energy to our American people.

Chris Wright (01:04:07):

Absolutely, senator. I share your concern there.

Senator Lee (01:04:12):

Senator Hoeven.

Senator Hoeven (01:04:15):

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Chris, as you've talked about deploying the latest, greatest technologies is how we produce more energy, more cost-effectively, more dependably with the best environmental stewardship. Not only here at home, but when we implement those technologies, the world follows. So that's actually the global solution. How do we actually bring folks along on that where they're skeptical like in fossil fuels? If they're skeptical of fossil fuels and so forth, how do we demonstrate to them that technology where we lead and we have the best environmental stewardship actually benefits globally? How do we convince them? What can you do?

Chris Wright (01:04:54):

Senator, thank you for the question. Thank you for your opening remarks as well. This is tough. I've spent my whole adult life engaged in dialogues about energy. When I went to MIT to work on fusion energy, I worked on solar energy at UC Berkeley. My whole thing is we want more energy in the world because it's what makes people's lives better. And you have to understand that there isn't dirty energy and clean energy. All energies are different and they all have different trade-offs. Different people have different weights or evaluations of trade-offs. Different geographies or locations have climates more favorable to this energy versus that energy. So it's a complicated dialogue, which means it's not easy to get people to share this broader perspective on it. I think we're seeing a little bit of that in passionate, well-meaning, wonderful people that have been sitting in the hearing room today.

(01:05:55)
But one of the things I've worked on is to try to just assemble the numbers and the data. When I was born, the world got kind of a mid-eighty percent of its total energy from hydrocarbons. And I was born, as we know, pretty much very close to 60 years ago, 60 years ago in a few hours right now. But today, total global primary energy is sort of low to mid-eighty percent. So global demand for energy's grown a lot. We've brought a lot of new energy technologies along, thankfully, or we wouldn't have as much energy as we have today, but it's proven very hard to displace hydrocarbons in the global energy system. And I'll say one last thing, senator, and turn it back to you. The other perspective I think that's important to look at is 1 billion people live lives like us. We get to wear fancy clothes made out of hydrocarbons, we get to use motorized transport and travel to visit our family and we have warm houses in the winter and we have cool houses in the summertime, but that's 1 billion people in the world.

(01:07:04)
There's 7 billion people in the world that don't live lives anything like we do. I've traveled to 55 countries and one thing I know, those 7 billion people, they want this. They want what we have. And of course, they should get what we have. And through market forces and improvement and leadership, particularly leadership from the president-elect Trump, I think we're going to see growing more abundant energy resource coming out of our country and hopefully out of the world so that everyone else can live lives like we do.

Senator Hoeven (01:07:39):

And I think it's really important that you are a voice for that because you'll have a platform to convince people and to explain what you just explained here. All different types of energies have strengths and weaknesses, but when we deploy these technologies, we lead the way, more energy, higher standard of living and better environmental stewardship, and that's really what you're all about rather than folks trying to say, "Well, we can't have this and we got to only have that." And so that's a big role for you to play. Following on that, you worked on hydraulic fracturing and so forth, it was technically feasible but it wasn't economically feasible, right? Same thing with other things like as the president's talked about clean coal technology. We've addressed SOx, NOx, mercury, and now CO-2. Will you commit to working with us to address the carbon capture, the CO-two capture, not only to address CO-two concerns, but also to use it as a resource for additional oil recovery? Our state's leading in that area, do you know that?

(01:08:44)
I want you to touch on that and then respond to whether you will come with me to the University of North Dakota, the Energy and Environmental Research Commission there and see what we're doing and work with us on things like Project Tundra to do this.

Chris Wright (01:09:01):

Thank you, Senator.

Senator Hoeven (01:09:02):

All in 10 seconds. I'm sorry.

Chris Wright (01:09:04):

My answer is a resounding yes.

Senator Hoeven (01:09:06):

Great. That's fine. Thank you.

Senator Lee (01:09:11):

Senator Padilla.

Sen. Padilla (01:09:12):

Thank you Mr. Chair. Look folks, we've all seen the devastation in Los Angeles due to the ongoing wildfires that have burned more than 40,000 acres of land this last week and have destroyed more than 12,000 structures and has led to more than two dozen lives being lost. The fires are now the most destructive natural disasters in Los Angeles' history. And despite the misinformation that's circulating here in the capitol, in Southern California and everywhere in between, it's clear that these fires only reached the size and the scale that they have because of unseasonably dry vegetation and extremely high winds, both of which are a direct result of climate change. Mr. Wright, thank you for being here, but as we've seen last week, the climate crisis and its deadly effects is very real to my neighbors and my constituents. As we discussed in our meeting yesterday, you were a longtime resident of California, so you've seen the conditions evolve firsthand.

(01:10:25)
So got to tell, I was pretty disappointed to come across some social media posts of yours, and I'll quote. I understand you've written, "The hype over wildfires is just hype to justify more impoverishment from bad government policies." Given the devastation that we're currently experiencing in Los Angeles, do you still believe that wildfires are just hype?

Chris Wright (01:10:58):

Sir, it is with great sorrow and fear that I watch what's happening in your city of LA in those fires.

Sen. Padilla (01:11:07):

Do you think it's just hype or not?

Chris Wright (01:11:10):

Climate change is a real and global phenomenon.

Sen. Padilla (01:11:12):

Is it hype or not?

Chris Wright (01:11:14):

I stand by my past comment.

Sen. Padilla (01:11:16):

So you believe it's hype?

Chris Wright (01:11:18):

Climate change is a real…

Sen. Padilla (01:11:20):

Tell that to the families of the more than two dozen lost in these fires and counting because the urban search and rescue teams are still going property by property with cadaver dogs. That number is going to climb. I'm disappointed, Mr. Wright. Let me make reference to another element of your social media. You re-posted a statement, so not your words, but you felt it important enough to amplify a social media post, and I'll quote, "Now obviously burning to death in a fire is pretty grim, but that is not what is happening like the climate zealots would like you to believe." So again, to the families of more than a couple of dozen of my constituents who have died in these fires, and that number is growing, like I mentioned, do you believe that Californians who have died over the past week are somehow just a figment of our imagination?

Chris Wright (01:12:21):

Of course not, Senator. It is heart-wrenching to watch the destruction. Most importantly…

Sen. Padilla (01:12:29):

And I'm not sorry for cutting you off here. I think the point has been made and you're standing by your posts, and I assume the reposts as well and I'll tell you why I'm further disappointed. We had I think a genuine conversation yesterday in my office. You said you have a science background. You pride yourself in leaning on facts and truth and evidence and data as you make decisions and decide which actions to take. So let me actually transition to something that's very substantive in this role should you be fortunate enough to be confirmed. One of the most important functions of the Department of Energy is research. We've discussed the 17 national labs, and you referenced it earlier in your testimony, that are working hard to tackle critical scientific challenges. California is home to three of these labs and we understand the need for these labs to advance our research and our knowledge. The data and research published by these labs and the department writ large are foundational for unlocking new technologies and maintaining our competitive advantages globally. Will you commit to publishing and not censoring non classified Department of Energy research?

Chris Wright (01:13:56):

Absolutely, Senator. The scientific process has been a key driver of our progress of our country and of our world.

Sen. Padilla (01:14:03):

And let me tell you why I feel the need to even ask the question. It should be a no brainer because it is a very real possibility that you may be asked by incoming President Trump, maybe through one of his intermediaries, to not publish or to withhold or otherwise suppress DOE research and studies. What would you do if asked?

Chris Wright (01:14:30):

I'm very proud to be serving. I hope if I have the privilege to be confirmed with incoming President Trump, he shares my passion for energy and for bettering American lives.

Sen. Padilla (01:14:41):

If asked, what would you do?

Chris Wright (01:14:44):

I will follow the scientific method. I will be honest in integrity and follow the laws and statutes of our country. Of course I will, senator.

Sen. Padilla (01:14:53):

What other question, my very little time remaining, and I'll just sort of cut to the chase. In my office, you shared with me your opinion that federal subsidies do not make sense for mature industries. Correct?

Chris Wright (01:15:12):

Less fruitful there. Yes.

Sen. Padilla (01:15:14):

And you included oil and gas in the examples of mature industries, correct?

Chris Wright (01:15:20):

Correct.

Sen. Padilla (01:15:21):

So please share with me and with my colleagues on this committee, expand on your belief that if oil and gas are truly mature industries and subsidies don't make sense here anymore and we should retract those subsidies and maybe direct those into smarter, more contemporary investments.

Chris Wright (01:15:42):

As a career entrepreneur, a free market advocate, my goal is to have a small role for government in business, particularly in mature businesses, just as I discussed. You have to have the rule of law, you have to have the enforcement of contracts, but the best role for the federal government is basic research and helping launch new technologies that are just getting their footing.

Sen. Padilla (01:16:07):

So I take that as a supportive position of rolling back subsidies for oil and gas. Thank you very much.

Senator Lee (01:16:14):

Thank you very much. We are in the presence of greatness as we have Senator Risch who is the chairman of the Foreign Relations Committee. He's got another cabinet nominee with Senator Rubio in front of his committee. Senator Barrasso has graciously agreed to allow Senator Risch to take the first couple minutes of his time and so we'll go hear from Senator Risch and then immediately thereafter Senator Barrasso.

Sen Risch (01:16:33):

Thank you very much and thank you Mr. Chairman and also Senator Barrasso for your indulgence here. I do have to get back. Mr. Wright, first of all, thank you for taking the time to meet with me. I came here today because I want to give you an opportunity to underscore your understanding of the importance of nuclear energy. As you know, Idaho is the birthplace of nuclear energy in the universe. We still have the first light bulbs that were lit with nuclear energy there at the Idaho National Lab. And as I explained to you, the Idaho National Lab is a incredibly important cog in the wheel of nuclear energy and appreciate your commitment to visit there and we will look forward to that. As I explained to you with the renaissance of nuclear energy, not only in America but even louder, really, in the world at large, we compete, we the United States of America compete with Russia, China and France in providing being a purveyor of nuclear power plants to other countries who are interested and there is so much interest right now.

(01:17:45)
And as I explained to you, when a contract is put out from another country, the importance of us being the winner in that because it creates a 100 year relationship as we go forward with nuclear energy. Could you take a minute to articulate your understanding of the importance that we the United States of America, and particularly the Idaho National Lab, the importance they have in leading the world as we go forward over the next decades and into this century on converting over to nuclear energy?

Chris Wright (01:18:23):

Thank you, Senator. And I very much enjoyed our visit. A lot to be proud of in Idaho, particularly Idaho National Lab, but the United States invented the technology of nuclear first for abrupt action weapons and then for commercial nuclear power. Of course we should lead in that. The President Trump, President-elect Trump and I are entirely aligned on this, but you're right, there's other players out there in the space and if the U.S moves slowly, other players are going to fill that vacuum much better. If that technology, that alliance, that partnership is with the United States, I'm firmly in favor of that. Nuclear is probably a smaller today energy source, only 4% of global energy. That could grow huge. It's had that potential for some time and I'd like to see it move faster as soon as we can.

Sen Risch (01:19:11):

I appreciate that and I agree with you. It not only can move faster, it will move faster. The advent of the small modular reactor, the SMR and the advent of the micro, which is going to be behind it fairly quickly. We are moving quick. China is competing with us as far as who can get these online quick enough, who can get them demonstrated quick enough, who can get the first commercials up and running. When that happens, there's going to be a stampede by countries to sign up to get SMRs and micros. And after talking with you, I'm convinced that you agree that we need to be a leader, the leader in doing that. So thank you for your understanding in that regard and look forward to working with you on that. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Senator Lee (01:20:01):

Senator Barrasso.

Sen. Barrasso (01:20:01):

Thanks so much. And first I want to congratulate you Senator Lee on being chairman of the committee for your first hearing at the helm and we're very grateful for your thoughtful leadership on these important hearings. We're getting underway and tomorrow we have North Dakota Governor Burgum who's here to testify. He was the nominee. And I assume we're going to hear another wonderful introduction by the former governor of North Dakota, Senator [inaudible 01:20:23].

Senator Lee (01:20:22):

Absolutely.

Sen. Barrasso (01:20:23):

Great. Thank you. Mr. Wright, congratulations. We've had a chance to visit. I have a number of questions and I'm going to submit most of them for writing. There were some questions from the senior senator from California about wildfires and you were abruptly cut off from trying to answer and he apologized for cutting you off, but I would want to give you time to now respond, if you'd like, for some of the comments that he had made that you weren't able to respond to.

Chris Wright (01:20:49):

As someone who has spent my life focused on poverty and poverty abatement in our country and abroad, seeing people suffering, seeing people in pain, seeing people lose family members, lose their property, lose their sense of self lose, their security is absolutely heart-wrenching. It's horrible to watch what's happening in LA today. And wow, these are the kind of things we want to protect people from. We want to make our society more resilient, stronger. There's no words to say in the middle of a personal trauma that reflect global policy and all that. These are human tragedies that touch every one of us. I lived in California for 19 years, have lots of friends in the L.A area. I'll probably get emotional talking about it. It's horrific to see what's happening there. We need to do everything we can to get those fires out, to get that infrastructure rebuilt and to get people to return to the lives they had before it was visited on by these horrific fires.

Sen. Barrasso (01:22:00):

I agree. It's heartbreaking. And I know we have our Wyoming National Guard there, equipment as well as manpower and trying to do that. Senator Cortez Masto made a point about… Actually it was your answer to Senator Cortez Masto mentioned that we've lost the capacity to enrich uranium. And America's dependent on imports right now to fuel our nuclear reactors, we have extremely limited commercial enrichment and conversion capacity, not in America's best interest. In 2023, Congress passed the Nuclear Fuel Security Act. We repurposed $2.7 billion in funding to support this goal. If confirmed, will you make it a priority to build and secure our nuclear fuel supply chain?

Chris Wright (01:22:40):

Senator, absolutely. I know we shared that concern in our dialogue in your office. It is a significant hole in the U.S arsenal right now. A technology we developed, but yet we import most of it from abroad, and most that's enriched in the U.S is by companies that are not American companies in the U.S. Yes, we need to build American nuclear infrastructure on mining, on enrichment, on power production and on waste disposal, which is a tough challenge.

Sen. Barrasso (01:23:08):

Congress passed legislation to ban imports of Russian uranium in the United States. This law is intended to revive American uranium production, strengthen our nuclear fuel supply. It has to be implemented correctly. The Secretary of Energy has the discretion to provide waivers to companies seeking to import uranium from Russia. Do you agree these waivers should be very limited and used only in extreme circumstances?

Chris Wright (01:23:30):

Senator, I would agree with that assessment. It is very sad how dependent we have become on imported, enriched uranium from Russia. That is a sad state of affairs where we are today. We need to get beyond that, but we need to get beyond that without shutting down the nuclear power plants we have running today. So it is an area that requires urgent action.

Sen. Barrasso (01:23:53):

Because it does seem that as they shutdown in Russian uranium, now we see more imports from China. So the next issue is, confirmed, will you support efforts to end uranium imports from China as we continue to try to build the U.S nuclear supply?

Chris Wright (01:24:07):

Yes, Senator. That is another country on which we should not be dependent upon for critical supplies, and of course enriched uranium to turn on our lights and power our factories, our critical supplies.

Sen. Barrasso (01:24:21):

And then finally, to advanced nuclear reactor and demonstration projects, Department of Energy's Advanced Reactor Demonstration program is meant to help developers overcome some of the hurdles that we have in terms of the expense early on with the development, programs received broad bipartisan support from this committee and across the Congress. So I look forward to getting the current projects over the finish line. Will you ensure the department continues to be a faithful partner in this mission?

Chris Wright (01:24:46):

Yes, Senator. I think that is a key role of the U.S government and particularly of the Department of the Energy to help bridge these technologies that have lots of running room, but mostly for government regulatory burden and uncertainty, have not been able to reach full commercial status yet.

Sen. Barrasso (01:25:03):

Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Senator Lee (01:25:05):

Thank you very much. We're now going to turn to another new member of the committee, our new colleague representing a state where I was born and it turns out a fellow fan of Mariachi music, Senator Gallego.

Sen. Gallego (01:25:16):

Gracias. Thank you, Chairman. Thank you Mr. Wright for your attendance here today. And thank you as well for meeting with me yesterday for a productive discussion about the energy future of Arizona. So I'd like to follow up and expand on a couple areas that we discussed and have been discussed here. So number one, I really do appreciate your enthusiasm for nuclear energy. And in my time in Congress I've supported annual appropriations for small modular reactors. We've heard a couple times about them here in SMRs and I do see great potential in them as a safe renewable energy source. However, SMRs and nuclear energy more broadly face several challenges including the cost of scaling, commercialization, public perception and permitting. As energy secretary, what actions will you take to improve the development and deployment of SMRs?

Chris Wright (01:26:02):

Thank you Senator for the question. Thank you for our great dialogue recently and congratulations also to be a new senator in this August body. It's a big challenge and I'm new to government so I can't list off the five levers I can pull, but I've certainly been in dialogues and investigations about how do we make it easier to research, to invest, to build things. I think DOE has land in facilities that can be helpful in this regard. My current company, Liberty Energy, owns part of a small modular reactor company called Oklo, and their first small modular reactor is going to be built in the Idaho National Lab, a DOE facility. So is there enabling role DOE can play to help launch nuclear energy? I think absolutely. I think it's both creative things like that, it's also research, it's also communication about the energy and the technology. Look, this should be a huge part of America's future energy source, but that won't happen without action within the legislature of the United States, with action from the Department of Energy and our incoming administration.

Sen. Gallego (01:27:13):

And I assume that this is where we'd have some communication from your ledge staff to us. What kind of legislation could we also be passing here to help really scale up SMRs and other types of nuclear energy to help cut through the regulations too?

Chris Wright (01:27:29):

Absolutely. The advance act that was passed not long ago I think is early on and I think it's a great first step. So some steps have been taken, but certainly more can be done.

Sen. Gallego (01:27:39):

Excellent. So Arizona is a state with ample renewable resources, sun, and a rapidly growing industrial sector. Since the passage of the IRA, Arizona has seen billions of dollars in new clean energy investments and created tens of thousands of really good paying jobs in some of our rural areas too. Some Republicans have started talking about dismantling and narrowing the energy provisions from the IRA, which in the end would not actually save money and doing so would actually cost Arizona middle class jobs, economic growth and also clean energy production, which I think we all agree we want as much energy production above no matter where it comes from. Will you commit to protecting clean energy production provisions of the IRA? And how will the Department of Energy ensure that previously authorized IRA funds are efficiently distributed?

Chris Wright (01:28:30):

Thank you for the question, Senator. Look, I'm not involved in lawmaking. That'll be here in the body of the Senate and the house. My goal would be to implement the laws of the land and maybe make some decisions on allocation of capital or funds that are approved by congressional bodies. And I will seek to allocate those funds in the most efficient way to grow our supply of affordable, reliable, secure energy, and to invest in technologies that can't do that today, but have a clear pathway to do that in the future. That I think is a critical function of the DOE, from basic research to emerging technologies to technologies that have been born but are not at commercial scale yet. I think there's a critical role from the DOE in all of those things

Sen. Gallego (01:29:24):

Now moving on from generation now to transmission because it doesn't really make a difference. [inaudible 01:29:30] can't move it, right? So I do believe that more transmission construction will also be vital to meeting the energy demands in the coming years all over the country, and I voted repeatedly to streamline the permitting for transmission energy projects. What would be your approach be to improving the timeline for transmission project approvals?

Chris Wright (01:29:49):

Well, I've been a passionate advocate for making, as I said in my opening statement, to make it easier to build things in America. It'll always be hard. It involves communities and space and movement of materials, but we need to be able to build things in America. You can't build the next generation system if you can't build anything. I think President Trump campaigned aggressively on building things again in America, on growing American energy production, on securing our electricity grid and driving down the price. The only way you can drive down the price of a critical commodity is to grow the supply. So there's going to be many different avenues to pursue there so I'm going to be learning, and learning from this committee in the most effective ways to do that, but I'm a hundred percent committed to growing our electricity grid and our energy production and removing those barriers that are standing in the way of doing things in Arizona and across our country.

Sen. Gallego (01:30:48):

Great. Look forward to working with you. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Chris Wright (01:30:50):

Thank you, Senator.

Senator Lee (01:30:51):

We'll turn now to our former chairman, Senator Murkowski.

Sen. Murkowski (01:30:55):

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And it's nice to be able to call you that. I think one of the benefits that you will see as being chairman is you get to listen to the testimony from beginning to end. And I will tell you that your testimony this morning, Mr. Wright, is so encouraging. I love the fact that you are a self-described energy geek. I love the fact that our colleague, Senator Hickenlooper, in his introduction calls you a scientist who's invested his life around energy. To have somebody before the committee who understands energy from the scientific perspective, from the entrepreneurial perspective, from the economic perspective to the security perspective, is truly extraordinarily unique. And so the fact that you have been nominated to this position and you have agreed to go through this process, thank you for that. You bring to the table, I think, just the type of enthusiasm and, quite honestly, the ability to communicate why energy is so key.

(01:32:02)
In our office, we talked about the fact that we have those who view energy somehow as a liability. We view it as an asset, we agree on that, but your focus about affordability and abundance is so important to understand. So there's been a lot of passion that you've heard in the back of the room today and you've had your back to it, but your ears and I think your heart is attuned to it because there is so much emotion that [inaudible 01:32:31] to what we're seeing with the changes in our climate today. And we can argue about the percentages or how much is human caused or whatever, but we are seeing that undeniably there is change. You are not denying that you have said before this committee and in other places that climate change is real. Is that correct?

Chris Wright (01:32:53):

Absolutely, Senator.

Sen. Murkowski (01:32:54):

And I heard you say this morning, and make sure I wrote this down correctly, that the solution to climate change is how we evolve our energy system. Is that a correct summation?

Chris Wright (01:33:06):

Absolutely, Senator.

Sen. Murkowski (01:33:07):

So it's about technology. We're acknowledging, we are dealing with it, we are living it and we're feeling it. We are feeling it in Alaska right now. I wish that I could tell you it was as cold as in Alaska right now as it is in Washington D.C this morning, but we are seeing changes that are detrimental to our system. Our thermostat is out of whack and we want to have the Arctic temperatures up north. But one of the ways that we know we're going to get there is through our technologies that will help us adapt, mitigate, and to really help prevent. So I want to direct a couple of my comments this morning more to the parochial side. We're talking about Arctic. We don't necessarily have the national labs, although we do have a great partnership with NREL with our cold climate housing.

(01:33:58)
We're very, very proud about that. But where do you think the Arctic Energy office, the office of Indian Energy and NREL's Alaska campus fit into your thinking when you're thinking about not only the technologies, but how you can use a place like Alaska as a proving ground for so many of these technologies where our energy costs are higher than just about any other place in the United States of America and arguably in parts of the world.

Chris Wright (01:34:26):

Senator, thanks for the question and thanks for the fabulous dialogue we had in your office. That was so broad-ranging. And as I think we discussed there, I view Alaska as a microcosm for the world. Now it's hard to call Alaska micro, but here you are, a state with just enormous energy resources set right next door to remote communities with very little energy access, and the energy access they do have is expensive. This is the combination of resources, lack of infrastructure, different settings need different energy sources. I have worked for years in this area, and in fact sitting behind me is the gal who runs our Bettering Human Lives foundation trying to bring energy access to remote villages in Africa. So when I hear of your Arctic Energy office and the communities you're trying to serve, this is the global problem. How do we get different energy solutions for different communities at different stage of economic development, at different lifestyles, different cultures?

(01:35:31)
And my vision, if I get the honor to be confirmed, maybe, is to expand on that Arctic Energy office to, this is an energy office for remote communities, for different communities. There's different technologies and different answers there than for industrial energy for manufacturing steel. I'm not going to do that in a small Alaskan village.

Sen. Murkowski (01:35:53):

It's appreciating the diversity of where we all are as well as the diversity of resources.

Sen. Murkowski (01:36:00):

… Sources. I want to ask one quick question, even though I'm at the edge of my time here, because nobody has really spoken to critical minerals this morning, and I view this as this next looming security vulnerability. If we want to move out with these energy technologies, regardless of where they are, we're going to need these minerals, and we recognize that. And I think we recognize that we are stronger when we are developing more of that here at home.

(01:36:31)
I shared with you in our meeting in December, how frustrated I was with the Department of Energy over its repeated subsidization of a graphite processing plant that was getting its supply of graphite from Mozambique. We have a natural graphite deposit up in Alaska, outside of Nome. The same day that we met the company behind that project that was importing graphite from Mozambique, was forced to declare force majeure. Why? Because of the violent unrest in Mozambique, and so now we've got millions of US taxpayer dollars that are at risk. And so it's something that I hope you will look at very critically, in terms of what we are doing to ensure that we are responsibly accessing our resources here, particularly in the critical minerals vein, but making sure that we're not embarking on exercises that are going to result in a loss of taxpayer dollars without any net benefit to the people here in this country.

(01:37:44)
I'm over my time, but I am really excited about the potential that you will bring to the energy discussion in this country. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Chris Wright (01:37:54):

Thank you, Senator.

Senator Lee (01:37:55):

Thanks, Senator Murkowski, we'll go next to Senator Cantwell.

Senator Maria Cantwell (01:37:57):

Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and before I begin my questioning, I just want to comment on, I've been on this committee since working with Chairman Murkowski. I mean, Frank Murkowski, which means I've served with a lot of chairmen in a lot of different committees. This committee has debated and argued over a lot of issues, but paperwork has never been one of them. So, I just hope that everybody will take a deep breath and understand that transparency in the process here is all that people want. And I think I know that people are anxious in the new administration to get their people, we want them to have that opportunity, but the transparency that it takes to just get the paperwork and have time for people to digest it is important and I think everything will go smoother if we can get that done.

(01:38:46)
Mr. Wright, congratulations on your nomination, and I had my colleagues who have said, "Thanks for your willingness to serve." I have to start with Hanford cleanup, I think you could go back to my record on every energy secretary, and that's where we would always start. I mean, we played a very important role for our nation during World War II, we're very proud of that. But the cleanup after the Manhattan Project also has to be historic and committed to over a long period of time. I have definitely voted for Republicans to be energy secretary, but they've also committed to cleaning up Hanford. And I want to ask you about your same commitment.

(01:39:25)
We as a state and the Department of Energy entered into a tri- party agreement, that has been updated recently into a final agreement. Will you commit to upholding the commitment that DOE has made to the timeframe and cleanup of Hanford waste? And usually, what happens is energy secretaries, or actually, that's not true. OMB people come in and say, "Oh, we can save money, we can do cleanup on the cheap, or we can get it done faster." Most of the time those ideas go in the trash can, but it puts you in a horrible situation because you have to fight for those dollars. So I just want to, will you commit to upholding the tri-party agreement between DOE and the state of Washington and others in supporting Hanford cleanup and advocating for a budget that represents that commitment?

Chris Wright (01:40:14):

Senator, I can't overstate how critical I think it is to finish the job, finish the cleanup at Hanford. The majority of our country's plutonium was produced there, not just for the World War II, but the post-war period, and our arsenal today. So, Hanford gave a lot to this country and we behind left a mess, and that needs to be cleaned up. It's being cleaned up, thanks in part to your efforts and many in your state to push for that, but I am firmly committed to continuing our obligations and our moral obligation to clean up the mess that was left in your state.

Senator Maria Cantwell (01:40:54):

Under that legal framework?

Chris Wright (01:40:58):

I will-

Senator Maria Cantwell (01:40:58):

You can take it for the record, but you need to look at that and just say, "Yes, I believe in that legal framework."

Chris Wright (01:41:04):

Yes.

Senator Maria Cantwell (01:41:05):

It's the process, that's where people get into trouble because somebody else tries to redefine the agreement that's been made, or let's just make it simpler. They try to redefine, what is the waste? And then they try to reclassify very hazardous waste into something else and then just say, "We're just going to leave it in the tanks or grounds," which are leaking, and we don't want those leaky tanks and those sources of very severe issues.

(01:41:31)
Okay. Secondly, do you believe in upholding investments in our capabilities in our national labs, particularly when it comes to the issue of AI and quantum? I think you and I had a chance to have this conversation. We think both of these things have major implications, but we have to have our labs continuing to play a leadership role with the right amount of funding, to continue a very important competitive national security agenda for our nation.

Chris Wright (01:41:58):

I agree very much with your comment and your question, Senator, and PNNL has done fabulous work in this area. Cybersecurity is a growing threat. It's not obvious to all Americans because we don't see it, but it's the infiltration into our systems, across our government and our industry from foreign actors is huge. And driving that research forward is critical for the security of our country, economic and geopolitical security of our country.

Senator Maria Cantwell (01:42:26):

Great. I know you know a lot about fusion. Do you think it's time that we look at fusion and… Let's just say, the Tri-Cities is doing everything, okay? So they're very much a hub for a lot of different energy innovation because of both the long history of the Hanford cleanup and a national lab footprint, and a lot of just natural resource issues. But do you think when it comes to fusion, that we ought to be more aggressive of thinking about, in case this does become a reality, supply chain and grid integration? Do you think that would be, behoove us as a nation to be faster at our deployment of such technology if we knew what those supply chain issues were now and identifying them and identifying what a faster process for getting something like that integrated into the grid would look like?

Chris Wright (01:43:28):

Yes, yes, Senator, this is an exciting new technology with again, just huge room to run, and it's moved very rapidly. The last decade has seen more progress than in my lifetime, and I would love to see that come to commercial power in the next decade.

Senator Maria Cantwell (01:43:43):

Great, and then just last. DOE has invested more than 14 billion in US power grid, and many states have had grid resiliency programs. I hope you'll continue to support those projects.

Chris Wright (01:43:57):

Grid resiliency, as I've talked throughout this hearing, is critical. It's the most urgent energy issue we have today.

Senator Maria Cantwell (01:44:05):

Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Chris Wright (01:44:06):

Thank you.

Senator Lee (01:44:07):

In just a moment, we're going to turn to another one of our new members who comes from an energy rich state, a state with some oil refineries as well, Senator McCormick. Before I do that, I just want to clarify one thing. You submitted your paperwork in a timely manner, and your paperwork now having received the final certification last night before close of business, should it trigger any questions, you'll make yourself available to members should they have any? Is that right?

Chris Wright (01:44:34):

Absolutely. Any questions about my disclosures or paperwork, please just reach directly out to me.

Senator Lee (01:44:39):

Senator McCormick.

Senator Dave McCormick (01:44:41):

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Wright, good to see you. It was great to have a meeting with you, and I'm excited about working with you. And we believe in Pennsylvania, the road to energy dominance goes through Pennsylvania, and it's critical to our future in Pennsylvania.

(01:44:54)
So, I'm going to ask you a couple questions. Forgive me, they're parochial, but I want to stay focused on the things that matter to Pennsylvanians, I'm going to hopefully do a quick lightning round here with you. First, the East Coast is at a significant disadvantage on LNG export capacity compared to the Gulf Coast, which is a big problem for getting Pennsylvania energy production to other parts of the countries, allies around the world. Can we work together on getting export terminals online, starting in Southeast Pennsylvania, outside of Philadelphia?

Chris Wright (01:45:22):

Senator, the more energy infrastructure we have in this country, the better for America, the better for Americans, the better for Pennsylvania. I agree very much with your desire there, I've expressed that, that view many times. We have the Marcus Hook terminal for natural gas liquids, but not for the main event, for methane and for natural gas. It would be hugely beneficial to Pennsylvania and to our country to have access, LNG export terminal on the Pennsylvania coast near Philly.

Senator Dave McCormick (01:45:53):

Great, thank you. We can't power the AI revolution without cheap and reliable power for data centers and tech clusters. In Pennsylvania, we've seen recently an innovative approach with a Microsoft arrangement with a Three Mile Island. You and I spoke when we were together about the potential for Pennsylvania to become really a leader with energy and AI going hand-in-hand.

(01:46:18)
And so as we discussed our meeting, I'm putting together a Pennsylvania Energy and Innovation Summit later this year to bring together the energy sector, leading AI companies, huge sources of capital, global investors to deliver on President Trump's vision to unleash American energy and technological leadership. And so, I'm looking forward to working with you and Secretary Burgum on that. Can I count on your support?

Chris Wright (01:46:43):

We had a great dialogue about that, Senator, and absolutely, you can count on my support. It's a great way to frame this issue. We want to build a new American industry in artificial intelligence and we want to lead the world in that industry. And boy, for our economic and national security, we better. It's, you can't build any new industry without the energy to support it. So you have this vision that's a great coming together of a new manufacturing industry to manufacture intelligence, and use the energy resources you have in Pennsylvania and attract the private investment capital to make it happen. I'm all in on that.

Senator Dave McCormick (01:47:18):

Thank you. Finally, we have a major opportunity in Pennsylvania to leverage our natural gas resources and carbon capture and storage technologies to produce blue hydrogen. Will the Trump Administration, with your leadership, ensure that federal support for the hydrogen development does not disadvantage blue hydrogen projects?

Chris Wright (01:47:42):

Senator, I know of what you speak, but I would say, too early for me to speak about trade-offs between different technologies in all that stuff, any commitments there. I will say again that the President, who I hope to be honored to serve, is very passionate about energy, about growing energy, about growing American production of energy. With the end, not just for energy in itself, but to enable better lives for Americans, stronger power, economic and political security for our country. Everything part of that mission, I think you'll see this administration's support.

Senator Dave McCormick (01:48:19):

Great. And finally, the Office of Fossil Energy has a storied history of driving innovations in the industry, including contributions to the shale revolution. One of the major labs is in Pittsburgh. How can we, as you take leadership if confirmed at the helm here, revitalize this office to focus on the next generation of fossil fuel innovations?

Chris Wright (01:48:40):

Yes, again, fossil fuels again, have powered the world throughout all of my lifetime and will continue to do so, has somehow fallen out of fashion and out of favor. So, even though it's a critical technology for us, there's been less interest to invest in it, less interest to talk about it. I don't share those aversions. I'm all about new technology to improve energy sources across the board, of course, including hydrocarbon energy sources as well.

Senator Dave McCormick (01:49:12):

One of the things that the center from Alaska said, which I am excited about too, is you're an innovator, you're a scientist. One of the consistent trends we've seen over the past decades is the reduction in carbon emissions as a consequence of technological innovation. So, by developing these innovations, we have more national security, we have greater economic growth in places like Pennsylvania, and we have a cleaner environment. What energy innovations are you most excited about, given the trends that you're seeing?

Chris Wright (01:49:42):

Oh, there's so many, but as you're talking there about natural gas in Pennsylvania, it's been the biggest driver of reducing America's greenhouse gas emissions. On a per capita basis, they were lower last year than any year since I was born. Think about that. This isn't a recent trend, this is any year since I was born and everyone knows my age now, so. I'm not going to say it, but everyone knows it since it's my birthday. But thank you, Senator.

Senator Dave McCormick (01:50:06):

Oh, you're going to end on a happy birthday. Thank you. Thank you.

Senator Lee (01:50:10):

Senator King.

Senator Angus King (01:50:12):

You picked a hell of a way to spend your birthday. Mr. Wright, I think your position on climate change is more subtle than is publicly recognized. As I understand it, you don't deny that there is climate change happening in the world, and that things like sea level rise and warming are occurring, and that they're related to the combustion of fossil fuels, which has drastically increased the amount of CO2 in the atmosphere. Is that correct?

Chris Wright (01:50:40):

Absolutely, Senator. I enjoyed our dialogue about that and future dialogues about that. But yeah, I've been outspoken about this for probably at least 20 years, mostly from the combustion of hydrocarbons to enable our modern worlds. We've increased atmospheric CO2 concentration by 50%.

Senator Angus King (01:50:57):

And that has affected-

Chris Wright (01:50:58):

Absorbs infrared radiation, makes it harder for the earth to shed heat.

Senator Angus King (01:51:02):

But as I understand, your position is, as I say, more subtle. You see a tension between diminishing our reliance on fossil fuels and powering those six million people who don't have adequate energy sources today. That's the kind of balance that you're talking about, is that correct?

Chris Wright (01:51:19):

Yeah, well stated, Senator. That is my view. Energy is critical to human lives. Climate change is a global challenge that we need to solve, and the trade-offs between those two are the decisions politicians make and they're the decisions that'll impact the future of our world and the quality of life.

Senator Angus King (01:51:39):

And those trade-offs are critically important. I think there are two observations. One is, you've said there's no energy transition. You're a walking energy transition. What you did in your work in shale was an energy revolution in this country that transitioned us in many ways toward natural gas. So, there is possible transition, it can happen either slowly, probably faster, fusion, SMRs, battery storage, all of those technologies. And I note that your company wasn't exclusively oil and gas, but it also has investments in battery technology, in nuclear SMRs. So, you do believe that we do need to diminish where we can, the emission intensity of our manufacture of energy.

Chris Wright (01:52:33):

Absolutely. Senator. You're bringing me back to the great dialogue we had about energy, about climate change, about trade-offs, and I appreciate very much your comments today. I am for improving all energy technologies that can better human lives and reduce emissions. They go together.

Senator Angus King (01:52:51):

I would add one note, however, and I understand the tension and I think that's reasonable. I remember saying years ago, "We can't tell the Indian nation that they can't have air conditioning because we don't want them to be using energy." The thing that has to be considered though is, what if you're wrong? What if we're wrong, and something really drastic happens? My concern that isn't discussed very much is a climate effect on the Atlantic currents. If something happened to the Gulf Stream, Britain, Scandinavia would be uninhabitable. So, I think we need to bear in mind that it's not as easy as saying, "We're going to help the Third World and we're going to keep burning fossil fuels." There is a significant risk that we have to have in our calculation. Would you agree?

Chris Wright (01:53:41):

Senator, I agree with that comment as well. In my writings on climate change, what I record a lot and talk about is what we do know, which is the past up to today. Predictions are hard, particularly about the future, and so yeah, I think we need to be humble about that. We don't know what's coming in the future, but advancement of energy technologies that grow, the amount of energy we have, the cost, drive down the cost, the quality and lower emissions, those are all wins, in all scenarios.

Senator Angus King (01:54:11):

And I'm hoping that 10 years from now, we'll look back on this discussion as rather quaint, because of technology, we'll have solved the problem. We're all working in that direction.

(01:54:19)
A couple of very quick questions. The Department of Energy has a role in approving LNG export terminals. It's supposed to determine the public interest, and I think Senator Hirono asked this, but I want to confirm that your office, your department will consider the effect on domestic natural gas prices of expanded LNG export capacity.

Chris Wright (01:54:45):

Absolutely true, senator. Nothing is more important than the supply, the affordability, and the access to energy to Americans in America. So, absolutely, that's a critical factor in that determination.

Senator Angus King (01:54:58):

And one other question, a couple of others I want to underline. Improving the energy structure of this country includes improved transmission. Is that correct?

Chris Wright (01:55:08):

Absolutely, that's one of our major bottlenecks today.

Senator Angus King (01:55:11):

And one of the things I hope you will continue research on is what are called GETs, grid enhancing technologies, which are non, you don't have to build a whole new tower. You can reconduct their technologies to improve the throughput of our grid. That I think is a direction we should move in. I commend the research on that to your department.

Chris Wright (01:55:33):

Thank you, and I agree with that comment as well, Senator. It was a dinner discussion last night.

Senator Angus King (01:55:39):

Well, I appreciate your testimony here today, and look forward to working with you. This is a critical area, you bring a unique perspective and breadth of knowledge, and I appreciate your willingness to take on this challenge. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Chris Wright (01:55:54):

Thank you, Senator.

Senator Lee (01:55:56):

Senator Daines.

Senator Steve Daines (01:55:57):

Chris, good to have you here. I get the best view here to see your family, I see Liz and had a grand baby there for a while, but as a new grandfather like you of six, I understand sometimes you have to step out for those busy moms and dads. But I did get a picture of that with your grand baby there, I sent it to you as well, so you'll have that as a memory from today. But it's great to have you here. I mean, your track record's amazing as an innovator, a scientist, mechanical engineer, electrical engineer. I'm a chemical engineer, so we could geek out here for a moment, but I just appreciate your thoughtfulness, looking at trade-offs in this complex areas, relates to energy and being thoughtful and intentional going forward here with getting the right policies for our country. So, thank you for stepping into the public service world. It's a sacrifice for you and your sweet family, and I want to thank you both for doing that.

(01:56:53)
As I step back and look at the numbers, a 30,000-foot view, I think we're going to need 50% more energy in the next 25 years than we currently consume today, globally. This has got to be a discussion increasingly on, how do we increase, how do we get more energy, not less, as we think about these tradeoffs. I think you play a really critical role here when confirmed as our Secretary of Energy. The last four years I've seen, I think taking some steps backward, unfortunately. We saw pauses on LNG exports, prohibiting new coal leasing in Eastern Montana, putting a pause overall on oil and gas development, even trying to ban new gas appliances. I think that's out of touch where the reality is, and that's why I appreciate, I think your pragmatism, as you look at where truth is, where physics are, and what the demand is going forward.

(01:57:47)
One of the first things you can do as secretary, I think, is to refocus the department on pro-baseload energy policies. Baseload power resources like coal, natural gas, hydropower, nuclear, I think will ensure that we have access to reliable and affordable energy year-round, whether it rains or snows or the sun's shining or not. The world needs more energy, not less, and with a proliferation of data centers, thinking about, well, how does Google and Microsoft and others think about it right now? They're buying baseload power. They need to think about baseload power as a way here to fund what they need to do here as it relates to the revolution going on in AI. Blockchain technologies, quantum computing, the load is, I think the 50% forecast, or more, is probably low, where this is probably actually going to land here, and you can help us get ahead of that curve.

(01:58:45)
So here's my question, Mr. Secretary to be. Will you promote policies both at DOE and throughout the government that will expand energy development and ensure that reliable and affordable baseload sources of power are protected?

Chris Wright (01:59:02):

Absolutely. Senator, if I get the honor and the privilege to be confirmed and to serve, top goal of mine, you just summarized the top goal. Our electricity grid, as I've said earlier in the testimony today, it's become more expensive and less reliable. Reversing a 100-year trend where that was becoming cheaper in inflation-adjusted cost and more reliable, and we've gone the other direction. We cannot go that direction. That's not good for America, it's not good for our industries, and that is a top priority of mine to work on.

Senator Steve Daines (01:59:35):

I think we violently agree that reducing emissions is better through innovation, not regulation. What are some ways you think about how innovation could help drive reduction in emissions?

Chris Wright (01:59:50):

Yeah, I mean, if you look at the track record right now, almost all of the emission reductions in our country and across the globe, almost all of them have come from innovations. In the United States, the biggest one by far has been the arrival of low-cost natural gas through the shale revolution. That was the innovation, it was not imposed. We got low-cost gas, lower emission gas, not just lower greenhouse gas emissions, but lower pollutants, lower particulate matter, lower SOx, lower NOx, that helps air quality.

(02:00:22)
Countries that have reduced… A lot of country emission reductions that have been from regulation and from top-down mandates have actually not been the emissions reductions they appear to be. They've more been in emissions removal. If you shut down industry in your country or in your state, the emissions from that industry don't go away, they just go somewhere else. And if they go out of the United States with the cleanest and most advanced manufacturing technology, those emissions just go up. So really, the only pathway to reduce greenhouse gas emissions and lift up people's quality of life is through energy innovation. And America has been a hotbed of that, and we need to return a vigor and a focus on innovation, on energy, right here in this country.

Senator Steve Daines (02:01:08):

All right, I'm out of time. One final quick sentence, statement is, as you know, Montana is becoming a quantum powerhouse. In places like Bozeman, in my hometown are leading in some of this high-tech innovation. We've got the Quantum Leadership Act that we're working on to spur more jobs and research in this area. My question is, when confirmed, will you work with me to bolster quantum and other next-gen technologies?

Chris Wright (02:01:34):

Not only I will, more importantly, this administration will. This administration and President-elect Trump is passionate about leading the next-generation industries and leading them here in America. Absolutely.

Senator Steve Daines (02:01:46):

Great, thank you.

Chris Wright (02:01:47):

Love your passion.

Senator Steve Daines (02:01:48):

Thank you.

Senator Lee (02:01:55):

[inaudible 02:01:55]. Yeah, he went while I was out.

(02:01:57)
Okay, we'll turn next to another new member of our committee, the great Senator from the great state of Arkansas, Senator Cotton.

Senator Tom Cotton (02:02:03):

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Wright, congratulations on your nomination. I apologize for my tardiness. I've been presiding over John Ratcliffe's hearing at the Intelligence Committee.

(02:02:12)
A geological survey recently found anywhere from five to 19 million tons of lithium reserves in the Smackover Formation, in particular in South Arkansas. Can you commit to working with my office to feasibly develop this rare and strategically vital supply of minerals?

Chris Wright (02:02:31):

Senator, thanks for your question, thanks for your service to our country. And absolutely, this is a different lithium production technology to get it out of brines. There seems to be an enormous resource of it in Arkansas, into the south of you. And I think that's an area of critical interest to our country and should be looked at, evaluated, and if it's commercially viable, developed.

Senator Tom Cotton (02:02:56):

Thank you very much for that commitment.

(02:02:59)
One of the responsibilities of the Department of Energy that is sometimes overlooked is the national laboratories. We do everything from nuclear development to quantum computing and other high-tech cutting edge. Unfortunately, these laboratories are a target of foreign espionage. In fiscal year 2023, more than 8,000 citizens from China and Russia were granted access to DOE national labs out of a total of 40,000 foreign users. It's my opinion and the opinion of many other senators in particular on the Intelligence Committee, the Department of Energy cannot continue to allow adversarial nations to exploit military and dual-use technologies for their own gain. What steps can you take to ensure that the department's national labs and other sensitive facilities are not compromised by our adversaries?

Chris Wright (02:03:54):

Thank you for the question, Senator. Thank you for your concern and focus on this issue. I've spoken at length today about what a treasure our national labs are. How they've transformed our country to where it exists today, and how they are really a vector to transform our country going forward as well. But if we have American innovation funded by American taxpayers, performed by American citizens, walk out the door and go to our foes for free and without knowing it, clearly, that undermines our national security. That undermines our economic security. I'm aware of the problem, in concept. If I have the privilege to be confirmed and serve in this role, I will quickly learn a lot more about the problem, including working with the team there and across the administration to find solutions to this critical problem you've identified. I agree with you about the gravity of the threat and the need to address it.

Senator Tom Cotton (02:04:55):

Thank you. I appreciate it. I'll just say that in our experience, many of the personnel at the labs are brilliant scientists who go on to become managers, but oftentimes they have a purely scientific mindset and they have it in their minds that they collaborate openly with fellow scientists from around the world, which may be fine if we're dealing with French scientists or Japanese scientists, but I'd say it's not the case with Chinese and Russian scientists. I'd also point out that the equivalent kinds of sites in China and Russia are not nearly so open to American scientists, and that would violate President Trump's treasured principle of reciprocity with foreign nations.

(02:05:34)
Finally, another key responsibility of the Department of Energy that's sometimes overlooked is the National Nuclear Security Administration. It actually constitutes almost 50% of the department's budget. Can you give us assurances that you'll advocate that the NNSA receives adequate resources to complete this top priority mission for our national security?

Chris Wright (02:05:58):

Absolutely, Senator. I have significant concerns in that area. Our uranium enrichment capabilities in the United States have been denuded over the last few decades, even our ability to produce plutonium pits has collapsed to nearly nothing. There's some efforts in place to reverse that, but I want to make sure they move as fast and expeditiously as possible. That is the ultimate guarantor of the sovereignty of our nation, is our nuclear arsenal. That is not something we can cut corners on and not worry about.

Senator Tom Cotton (02:06:28):

Well, thank you very much. I appreciate, again your testimony and your answers on these critical questions that are not always highlighted when you think about the Department of Energy, but they cross into our work on the Armed Services Committee and on the Intelligence Committee, where I believe we'll see you in the future as well, in addition to vital energy development questions like this macro formation. So, thank you very much for your testimony. Congratulations again, I look forward to working with you.

Chris Wright (02:06:55):

Thank you, Senator, particularly for working two hearings at the same time.

Senator Lee (02:06:59):

Thank you, Senator Cotton. Round one is now complete and hereby notify all members if you want to participate in a round two, come back right away because round two tends to go pretty fast. We'll start that now again with five-minute rounds.

(02:07:15)
The beginning of my second round. I just want to ask you a little bit about the Department of Energy's Appliance Standards programs. Some of these regulations are of concern, or least ought to be noticed by the American people, as they impact all Americans in one way or another. They reach almost all equipment that uses energy to any significant degree in American's homes. So, dishwashers, clothes dryers, clothes washers, light bulbs, and a whole lot more. There are consumer protections, of course, built into the statute, protections that were designed to ensure that things wouldn't get too expensive and that quality didn't fall off the table in connection with them. But

Senator Lee (02:08:00):

… In contrast to the previous Trump administration, the Biden administration has run somewhat roughshod over some of those consumer protections built into the law. This effort was of course in service of the Biden administration's whole of government focus on reducing greenhouse gas emissions, sometimes to the exclusion of authorized statutory mandates. What will you do to ensure that maximum protections for American families and consumers will be recognized and respected if you're confirmed as energy secretary when implementing the Appliance Standards program?

Chris Wright (02:08:41):

Thank you, Senator. Thank you for that question and for raising that concern. I can assure you that concern is on the mind of millions of Americans across the country. I hear it very often. We want to drive in the Department of Energy and the government wants to drive innovation and more efficient technologies, meaning delivering the same end with less inputs. That's advancement, that's technology. But to take clothes dryers, for example, it takes heat and it takes airflow and both of those take energy. And I look at some new appliances today, and well they use half the energy per minute, but if it takes an hour to dry your clothes instead of 30 minutes to dry your clothes, it's the same energy consumption and you lost a half an hour.

(02:09:27)
So does regulation go well beyond what's sensible and logical? It does a lot. It does a lot. And what I want to do is look at what's happening there, what's driving that analysis and are we playing a role of a reasonable regulator or are we trying to check boxes or make achievements where the trade-offs are simply not worth it? I think you should always be a little humble and a little cautious when you're proposing to reduce the choices of American consumers.

Senator Lee (02:10:00):

That is a fair point, especially when you're dealing with administratively promulgated rules that themselves have the effect of generally applicable federal law. They're enforceable as such. If they're not complied with, they can result in massive fines. They can result in somebody's business getting shut down. They can, even in some cases with some administratively promulgated regulations, result in prison time if you fail to abide by them. And so that's all the more important. Anytime you're taking away consumer choice, that's a concern. Anytime you are making new law outside the people's elected lawmaking branch, that's also a concern.

(02:10:40)
We've got a number of things in front of us. One of the things that I've enjoyed reading is this document, which I understand you yourself wrote. It's entitled Bettering Human Lives. And you see energy is playing a significant role in that. In this you take on a whole bunch of different issues, including the fact that as a result of the fact that we as Americans have access to reliable, affordable, clean electric power, we're able to avoid a lot of problems that in many other countries they face. For example, you cite some alarming statistics from the government of Kenya, the Kenyan Ministry of Health, talking about respiratory infections. Tell me how those relate to the availability of affordable, reliable electric power.

Chris Wright (02:11:33):

Yeah, I view this as maybe, Senator, the most urgent energy challenge on the planet today, which is just simply the access of basic clean cooking fuels, also used for heating, but all of our ancestors all stayed warm and cooked food burning wood. And regrettably, more than 2 billion people on the planet today still burn wood indoors, sometimes charcoal or dung, but mostly wood indoors to cook their meals and keep their house at a safe temperature. That indoor air pollution kills over 2 million people every year. This is outrageous and it's entirely solvable. And in fact, one of the things I'm most proud of the shale revolution is while we've well more than doubled oil production, nearly doubled natural gas production, we've quadrupled US propane production. We've gone from the eighth-largest exporter to by far and away the largest exporter and we're making propane, that critical fuel that replaces wood to make people's lives longer, healthier, and more opportunity rich. A lot to be proud of in this country, but there's so many other energy challenges out there that are little known and therefore not addressed, but we can do better.

Senator Lee (02:12:49):

Indeed. Thank you. Senator Heinrich.

Senator Heinrich (02:12:53):

Thank you, Chairman. So I tend to approach energy with four goals, and one of the primary ones is affordability. Reliability is always non-negotiable. That's critical. And to the extent our policies can make them both abundant and clean, those are things that are incredibly important to my constituents. We've heard a lot about cost today, and I know you and I talked a lot about affordability when you visited me in my office. And so I pulled up the latest cost data for wholesale generation costs in cents per kilowatt-hour from Lazard. Would you consider Lazard data to be fairly reliable?

Chris Wright (02:13:40):

Well, Lazard, Senator is-

Senator Heinrich (02:13:42):

They were the easiest to pull up, but…

Chris Wright (02:13:45):

They're the most famous for publishing statistics on levelized costs of energy.

Senator Heinrich (02:13:50):

Exactly. No subsidies involved. Levelized.

Chris Wright (02:13:54):

Levelized misses the boat on electricity generation because it treats it like… Would you take an Uber that was 10% cheaper in cost if you didn't know when the Uber was going to show up and where it was going to drop you off?

Senator Heinrich (02:14:11):

So one of the reasons why I raise this is because in New Mexico I think we have been able to do both of those things at the same time. So we've pursued both affordability… Actually I should say all three things, affordability, reliability, but also clean. And I know in 2023 there was a statement that you made that said wind and solar energy will, "Likely never leave single digits." I guess as a percent of total energy. And I know you understand the difference between the grid and transportation and heat energy that we use in our total energy balance. But when it comes to the grid in New Mexico, in just my utility, which we talked a little bit about in my office, they now produce 58% of their generation from carbon-free renewables and nuclear, nuclear being the smallest of that at about 7%. Wind and solar, solar being 35% and wind being 15% of their kilowatt-hours.

(02:15:22)
So that means that when you combine that with storage resources, which are primarily getting charged by clean excess renewables, that their penetration rates are now well into the sixties, even the low seventies. When Chris Wright says, "These resources will likely never leave single digits." It's one thing, but if the Secretary of energy says that, I think people will get a different impression. So how do you square those two very different data sets?

Chris Wright (02:16:05):

Thank you, Senator, and I appreciate the question. I appreciate our shared interest in affordable, reliable, secure energy, and I think New Mexico's done some great things there. Globally, which is what I talk about mostly in that report, in 2023, the last year we have full data, wind, solar, and batteries were 2.6% of global primary energy. In the US, they're a little more than 3%, but not wildly higher than the global. Electricity only delivers 20% of global primary energy. So getting to 50% in electricity, which would be an incredibly high penetration, that would be double digits.

(02:16:46)
But where most of the energy is consumed in the world today and where it's growing the fastest is in South, Asia Southeast Asia, Northern Africa and through the… Mostly South Asia and Southeast Asia. These are countries with very poor wind resources and actually not very good solar resources. India's got some dry places and some deserts and good resources, but Vietnam, Malaysia, Indonesia, if you go to the places where energy growth is rising the fastest, they don't have great wind and solar resources.

Senator Heinrich (02:17:22):

That was the context of your statement?

Chris Wright (02:17:24):

Global energy.

Senator Heinrich (02:17:25):

Because I want to make sure that we understand what we as a country are accomplishing. And if you just look back at the last year's worth of data, the first 11 months of 2024, and you look at new generation, the vast majority of that… And I don't have the figure in front of me, but it came out in the last couple of weeks, the vast, vast majority of that is all clean energy. And so if we can take some of these lessons from what we've been able to accomplish as a world leader in energy and use them to help people in the world have access to the abundance that you talk about, I just think it's important to understand the rate of change in some of these systems is not linear. And so we're seeing, for example, last year in the US, the vast majority of that generation on the electric grid being clean.

Chris Wright (02:18:16):

I agree, Senator. Thank you, and I appreciate your passion for numbers and energy as well. Thank you for the good comments.

Senator Heinrich (02:18:22):

We need more data guys.

Senator Lee (02:18:26):

Senator Murkowski.

Sen. Murkowski (02:18:30):

Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and I appreciate the opportunity for a second round here. I mentioned critical minerals. I'd like to ask you a little bit more about geothermal, because as we think about these areas of opportunity, there's a lot of focus on wind and solar, and I don't mean to be pointing to my friend from Colorado there, but geothermal is kind of like it's the mature technology because it's been around for a while, but the technologies that are being used nowadays are not necessarily what we have seen in the past.

(02:19:12)
You have had an interest in this, a business interest, and I'm a little bit excited to know what you think the potential is for you in this new role at DOE to help accelerate more in the geothermal development space and reduce some of the project uncertainty. So I'm looking for better assurance for some of those bright people who have these crazy wild ideas that we can do things on ADAC and on Alaska and out on Mount Spur to try to reduce barriers to entry in an energy area that's been around for a long time that should not be so hard. What can we do, and are you excited about it from a DOE perspective?

Chris Wright (02:20:05):

Very much so. Very much so. Look, I'm uprooting my life and moving to Washington DC if I get the honor and privilege of being confirmed because I love energy, all kinds of energy for all Americans. And I love that you highlight geothermal, just tremendous potential energy source. I worked on this 30-some years ago and wrote some papers about it, and a new idea called hot dry rock. Geothermal today is where there's hot rocks, approachable, they have fractures in them so fluid can flow and they're full of water. Well, that's a small set of the microcosm, but anywhere we drill… Right here, we drill three miles underground, it's exceedingly hot. That energy is sitting there. So the idea of hot dry rock is to inject water into a well, flow through that rock and therefore take some of the heat out of that rock and make that water very hot and then flow it up and produce electricity from it, produce heating for homes or houses. It's just an enormous abundant energy resource below everyone's feet.

Sen. Murkowski (02:21:06):

Can I interrupt you and just ask you to save that energy and passion for when you are confirmed as Secretary of Energy and elevate this within the Department. I know everybody wants to get to the top of the list, but if I can express disappointment with what I have seen within the Department of Energy over the years, we've seen great things in great areas and geothermal just sits back there as the forgotten child, and we're not going to allow that to happen. So I appreciate that passion.

(02:21:42)
Let me ask you about Alaska's natural gas. You've talked a lot about how we've really seen this revolution when it comes to being able to access our natural gas through the fracking. You know Alaska, you've been up there, you know our issues. Congress has approved a loan guarantee for an Alaska gas line, and I would just ask for your support if confirmed that you're going to work with the delegation to help stand up the loan guarantee through regulations, whatever may be necessary to ensure that DOE can actually accept the application when the project proponents are ready. It should be an easy answer.

Chris Wright (02:22:27):

Yeah, Senator, tremendous resources in Alaska of oil, natural gas, minerals, mining, logging, geothermal. You've got it all. You've got it all. And to grow natural gas production in Alaska and build infrastructure to export that to the world, given how close it is to the biggest, fastest growing markets in the world in Asia, I think is a tremendous idea. Great for our country, great for Alaska, and I'm confident that President-elect Trump will be a champion of these ideas, of growing American energy production and influence in the world.

Sen. Murkowski (02:23:00):

Well, we've got it. As you mentioned, we have it and we're ready, willing, we just need good partners at the federal level to help us advance this. And last point on that. We have seen some really critical energy investments in Alaska as a result of the Infrastructure Investment Jobs Act. A lot of folks on this committee helped with that, but the DOE programs that are funded by IIJA have provided a lot of benefit to Alaska projects so far. Most of them are already underway.

(02:23:35)
They range everything from the rural renewable energy investments, carbon storage, transmission upgrades is huge, demonstration of long duration storage. So I just want your assurance that we're going to still be able to continue these projects as a priority within DOE. What we have started, we don't want to have a drop-off here. We want to have a smooth transition for these existing DOE projects to be able to continue to allow us to build out that infrastructure, that transmission capacity that's going to allow for a betterment of Alaskans and really our opportunity to help Americans.

Chris Wright (02:24:22):

I'm thrilled to see the breadth of energy innovation in Alaska and would love to see that continue and expect that it will continue.

Sen. Murkowski (02:24:28):

Are you going to come up and visit?

Chris Wright (02:24:31):

Absolutely.

Sen. Murkowski (02:24:32):

I figured it didn't take much of an invitation. I appreciate the fact that you've got ties to the area already, and I appreciate that. But thank you for your willingness to give the committee this much time. I know that you've got a lot more energy, but I think that your grandson is probably bored with us. So it might be time to end. Mr. Chairman.

Senator Lee (02:24:53):

I think his grandson seems riveted actually. Before we go to Senator Hickenlooper, I'll note that love the geothermal discussion. Senator Heinrich and I have a bill together on geothermal. We've got access to heat like that, might as well harness it just as we would with Puff the Magic Dragon. If we could find and harness him, then we'd make power out of him somehow. Senator Hickenlooper, and then we'll go to Senator Hoeven.

Senator Hickenlooper (02:25:17):

Thank you, Mr. Chair. And again, glad to back. I don't think I have to extend an invitation to come to Colorado.

Chris Wright (02:25:25):

I accept.

Senator Hickenlooper (02:25:27):

And I do appreciate, and there was some… I understand how quickly things were working and how hard you were to get your financial information, your ethical disclosures, the FBI background check that we didn't get it until… I never saw it. I had a dinner last night and then I had meetings starting this morning. But I do look at geothermal, which I share your enthusiasm, and I want to ask a question about how rapidly you think it can scale. But it's something so promising, obviously you've thought through your conflict of interest in something like that where you've helped dramatically… You've been part of the catalyst to allow the geothermal that we can imagine at scale, at least I'm imagining at scale. You've thought through that? I don't have any of the numbers in front of me yet.

Chris Wright (02:26:16):

Yeah, thank you for that question, Senator. But my involvement with a particular company, I think a leader in next-generation geothermal, Fervo Energy, I will sever all ties, financial involvement with Fervo in everything I do in energy. I'm still passionate about it. I'm going to be a champion for it. And even in my world in the small modular reactor, our company and I'm a director of one of those small modular reactor companies, but I'm cheering for all of them. And yes, I will sever all of my ties from across the whole energy space. But I won't sever my passion for seeing those technologies advance to better American lives.

Senator Hickenlooper (02:26:54):

I appreciate that and I appreciate that you're open to discussing it with other senators, once they've seen those documents that they have questions. I appreciate that.

Chris Wright (02:27:03):

Absolutely. Yeah, given the compressed timeframe, if anyone has any questions about anything in my disclosure form, as you know, sometimes to your detriment, I'm an open book and so are you.

Senator Hickenlooper (02:27:14):

Fair enough. In terms of geothermal, and you know the details better than I, how rapid can we get that to scale? Because the transformational capability of that, as you've described before, it can do some of the making of things. It can be high temperature that actually does displace hydrocarbons in a successful way.

Chris Wright (02:27:40):

So Fervo right now is building a 400 megawatt plant in Senator Lee's state. And one of the reasons they can do it in that scale is there already is nearby electrical infrastructure. But Senator, we'll circle back to everyone's top issue today. One of the limiters in the growth of geothermal is there's so many resources out there, but there aren't easy ways to connect to power lines, to sell that power to users. There are a number, so we're going to see gigawatts come on in the next few years, but could it be tens of gigawatts with infrastructure? It could.

Senator Hickenlooper (02:28:15):

Well, we're aligned on that, and I have a couple of bills that we've worked on, the BIG WIRES Act. You'll get immersed in all that soon enough. Let me talk a little bit about nuclear waste because we haven't really talked about that, but I was someone when I was a kid, protested against nuclear energy, couldn't get my arms around how we deal with the waste. I think looking now at some of the risks of climate change and the possibility that acceleration of climate change is worse than they think makes the nuclear, the issues around the waste, we still have to deal with it and deal with it safely. Have you got any ideas of how to do that and help… Especially some of the younger people in this country are very concerned about nuclear as a solution, but it's clean, it has high-temperature capability. It can do so many things if we could figure out how to deal with the waste.

Chris Wright (02:29:09):

Yeah, and I think that the concern of kids and us when we were young and everyone else of nuclear, and of climate change, they're all very justified concerns. These are real things. Radioactive materials are dangerous. But fortunately I think with engineering and sensible regulation is safeguards, I think the nuclear waste problem is one of the most manageable problems, because the volume of waste is relatively small. We've been selling commercial nuclear power for over 70 years and all of that waste today is in swimming pools on location cooling off at the start and then it's in big dry casks right on location in urban or suburban areas.

(02:29:50)
And it's been there for 70 years, and the radioactivity near those power plants is lower than Grand Central Station in New York City, the subway station. So I think even without permanent repository, we've been able to do that in a safe way. It's better in the long run to have a more remote, probably deep storage, but there's many ways to do it. I think the politics of it are the trickiest part, but they matter. You need to have people on board. We don't want people with fear and anxiety about what's going on. So it's a political and social challenge, but technically can we deal with nuclear waste safely? I believe firmly we can and we have.

Senator Hickenlooper (02:30:29):

Well, thank you. And I'm out of time, but I think we're going to have to figure out how to have that national discussion to make sure people are aware of how engineering and how technology and innovation can help us make sure that is truly safe. Thank you.

Chris Wright (02:30:43):

Thank you, Senator.

Senator Lee (02:30:45):

I hope we're not actually seeing them in swimming pools where people are swimming. [inaudible 02:30:49]. Senator Hoeven.

Senator Hoeven (02:30:50):

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Chris, I'm also on Defense Appropriations and I just want to follow up for a minute on a question that was asked by Senator Tom Cotton, and that's the work of the NNSA and the national labs in regard to our military. In my state, we have the only dual nuclear mission Air Force base in the country. And the work at the NNSA and the national labs is vital as we upgrade our nuclear triad. Will you commit to work with me on that very important function for DOE on behalf of our country and our military?

Chris Wright (02:31:30):

Absolutely, Senator. This is foundational to our security, to our way of life.

Senator Hoeven (02:31:35):

Right on. I want to thank you for your very open and articulate responses across the board this morning. Just an outstanding job. And I mean an open, knowledgeable and articulate, and I think all of us on the committee could see that very clearly. And the only other thing I would put forth, is there anything else that you would want to put on the record? I just want to give you that opportunity before we adjourn, and the chairman may well do that as well. But if there is anything else I want to give you that opportunity. Anything you wanted to respond to or anything else that you wanted on the record?

Chris Wright (02:32:12):

Thank you, Senator for that. I'll end with just a couple comments that have been in my mind. One is to come back to Senator Heinrich and say, New Mexico has fantastic solar and wind resources and you've responsibly developed them. So look, I don't want you to feel there's more tension or disagreement there than it sounds like. The other thing I'll end with, and I think we share that, everyone in this room is that the importance of energy and the affordability of it. 10% of Americans got a disconnection notice to their utilities in the last 12 months.

(02:32:44)
More than 20% of Americans report struggles paying their bills, whether it's paying their energy bills, whether it's filling their car with gas or heating their home or paying their electricity bill. So this is important. It's not just important for national security and industry and all that, it's important for the quality of life of every American. So I thank everyone on this committee to be dedicated to energy and natural resources. I would be honored to work with you all on this just critically important thing. And energy is the infrastructure of life. It's what makes everything possible. Thank you all for the great dialogue, questions today, and thank you for your service to our country.

Senator Lee (02:33:28):

Thank you so much, Mr. Wright. I really appreciate you being here. My colleagues and I, we can be a lively bunch and you've handled our questions, responded well to them and I appreciate your family coming. I want to thank the members of the committee, the committee staff, and especially the Capitol Police who have been here today to keep us safe and keep things orderly. Thank you for your work. The record for today will stand open and ready to receive questions for the record until 6:00 PM today. And we stand adjourned. Thank you very much.

Chris Wright (02:33:57):

Thank you.